Transcript
Zain
0:03
This is The Strategist, episode 934. My name is Zain Velji. With me, as always, Corey Hogan, Stephen Carter, guys. Dan, there's no time for
Corey
0:11
for the rest of that sentence. We've got to talk about all of the news.
Zain
0:15
Oh, it's unfortunate, because I was going to wish you guys Happy Father's Day. But now when we re-record it, I won't.
Zain
0:21
I'll actually totally skip it.
Corey
0:23
Well, you don't actually control whether we re-record or not, so. Yeah, are we just going? I think we're just going. yeah okay
Carter
0:29
so which is a happy father's day happy father's day
Carter
0:33
about time someone wished me a happy father's day the
Zain
0:36
the level of entitlement on this show is un-fucking-believable uh cory happy father's day to you too thank
Corey
0:42
thank you i've got a lot of children and yeah yeah
Corey
0:48
a result i need a lot of thanks for for my fathering yeah
Zain
0:52
yeah well that's good i'm glad i'm glad you're getting thanks uh carter what do you think is uh is trey young going to the nba finals if
Carter
1:00
if i knew who trey young was i might have a chance of answering that question supposed to
Zain
1:03
to do on the show that is not what you're supposed to do on the
Carter
1:06
the show no i mean he's gonna go he's got he's gonna go to the finals for sure of course what's
Zain
1:10
what's that one quality that he has that will that will uh that will elevate him to the promised land carter he
Carter
1:15
he distributes the ball he
Carter
1:17
he distributes the ball and that's what but makes a championship team.
Corey
1:22
What are we giving Carter on that? It's... You know what? It was vague enough. It's okay. It's fine. He's not going to the finals, though. The Hawks are not going to the finals.
Carter
1:31
finals. Oh, come on. The Hawks have got it. Who's going to go? The Bucs? Come on.
Corey
1:37
-fact Carter all of a sudden. Yeah,
Zain
1:38
Yeah, two-fact. Two-fact Carter. Very nice. I saw that on
Carter
1:41
on a Twitter thing or something. I don't remember.
Zain
1:44
Excellent. Excellent. No, this start is good. We are back. We skipped Thursday's episode. Of course, Corey, you explained the reason why I was introspecting on my magical abilities to moderate this show and how it might disappear. And turns out, the first two minutes are any side. My
Zain
2:01
My skills have left me. My skills of keeping this show entertaining and on the rails have left me. And it's just going to go downhill from here. Carter. when did
Carter
2:11
did you think you had it like
Carter
2:13
like this is the thing that we didn't understand when you had your like i was told i was promoted over
Zain
2:18
over chester at some point and no he wouldn't
Carter
2:20
wouldn't do it anymore
Zain
2:22
that's not what i was told well
Carter
2:24
told you a story zane i think you're old hr memo that i got
Zain
2:26
got it's not the hr memo i got okay
Zain
2:30
wasn't okay well let's let's jump into this we got a lot to talk about let's move it on to our first segment our first segment the greatest defense is a potent Potent offense. No, Carter, I'm not going to be talking about Trey Young. I'm not going to be talking about the Hawks. I know you're a big fanboy of said Trey Young and Atlanta Hawks. No, I'm going to talk about Annamie Paul. I'm going to be talking about her remarks against Justin Trudeau. She came out in multiple, two, press conferences after her former MP, Jennica Atwin, crossed the floors to the Liberals, coming out against the Prime Minister in a press conference, saying that he's undermining strong women capable at the height of their careers. He's pushing strong, competent, capable women out of politics. He is no feminist. She also, you know, went after Christopher Freeland, saying that, I'm also going to say shame on Christopher Freeland for her complicity in this, for being his female shield amongst all of that. Guys, I want to talk about this from a strategy perspective. You know, to set the table a bit, Annamie Paul is fighting an uphill battle. She's got a vote of non-confidence from her councillors, her party councillors, that has been delayed, if I'm not mistaken. She's trying to come out on the offensive about what happened with the foreclosing of Jennica Atwin. I want to talk about the strategy here. Is it a good strategy what she's done in this past week, going so aggressively against the prime minister, going so aggressively against Christopher Freeland, or is this a tactic of desperation? So that's the framing I want to kind of start this conversation with Carter. And maybe we'll start with initial thoughts from you around surprise. When you saw these first and then second press conferences, the first one where she cut off and the second one she came back and delivered some more, were you surprised by the tact that Green Party leader Annamie Paul took against Justin Trudeau? And was he the right target from a political strategy perspective? Let's start here and then we'll do our thing and move on from there. Yeah.
Carter
4:28
Yeah. Was I surprised? Yes, I was. I didn't think that this was an arrow she had in the quiver. You know, we hadn't necessarily seen this before in terms of being able to to launch a big full scale attack. She did launch the attack. And in terms of your second part of your question, was it was it strategically wise? Yeah, it was. It changed the channel. It was a channel changer. Didn't completely change the channel. There were some things that kind of came back to haunt her as more evidence
Carter
4:55
evidence came back about how she treated the New Brunswick MP. But this is just a, you know, it was interesting to see her have that arrow in the quiver. I'm not sure I would have recommended it, but I certainly see why she strategically chose it. It was a great channel changer. It it it showed us something that we didn't expect. And it gave gave her a news cycle, which is something, frankly, the Green Party hasn't been doing on a positive sense. And we could argue about whether or not this is totally positive. I, I see the negatives of the tactic as well. But strategically, this made sense. It was a channel changer. And she changed the channel if she didn't change it quite as much as she wanted to. Yeah,
Zain
5:42
Yeah, Corey, you know, the ongoing story of the Greens is that they're always on the cusp or they're always on the precipice of making a breakthrough somewhere, somehow over the last decade. Was this wise strategy from Annamie Paul going after Justin Trudeau in such blatant and explicit terms?
Corey
6:01
You talked about the best defense being a strong offense. Well, this really was a situation where she just started throwing haymakers. And it's
Corey
6:10
it's not clear to me that that was the wrong strategy. I think there were components of it that were perhaps
Corey
6:15
perhaps exposing herself to counter punches, shall we say. But it's not just that she changed the channel. It's that she conflated her leadership issues with the overall situation
Corey
6:25
situation for women in politics, in particular minority women in politics. And that was not a bad idea, right? Because all of a sudden, it's not so much about Annamie Paul, female
Corey
6:39
driving away female MP, but it becomes about the very nature of politics. And it was just close enough, but different enough that it allowed you to sort of just say, well, maybe she's got a point about politics overall.
Corey
6:52
And maybe that was her intention with it. Now, where I think there were components of it that were not particularly, shall
Corey
6:59
shall we say, advisable,
Corey
7:02
going after Freelance is top of my list right there. In terms
Zain
7:06
terms of that strategy, you mean?
Corey
7:24
went a bit off the rails and made me think maybe it's not strategy at all maybe it is just throwing wild haymakers yeah
Zain
7:42
yeah and carter to that point did you did you look at this as strategy when you first saw it did you look at it as strategy or did you see it as to cory's point haymakers or if i'll inject a word that i did at the top of the segment desperation to keep her leadership
Carter
7:55
yeah i mean it was an embattled leader trying to stave off a very negative outcome um but But nonetheless, I mean, strategies don't just come when everything's going rosy. We have to develop strategies when things are in the shitter, too. And she's in the shitter. So developing a strategy to get out of it and hold on to her leadership was required. And, you know, Corey makes a good point about having two people to go after instead of one. It would have been much tighter if it was just the prime minister. He does have issues that have dogged him around women and his approach to working with women as a quote-unquote feminist prime minister.
Carter
8:37
It wouldn't have landed with everybody, but people who wanted to hear it probably would have heard it very clearly. Bringing in Freeland, I think Corey's made a good point, and it did pull away from the overall efficacy of the attack.
Zain
8:51
Carter, I'm going to come back to the specifics of this and whether it will work for enemy Paul, But can we maybe expand this a bit? Like, is there anything that this episode, these two episodes, if we call them the two press conferences, has taught you or has reinforced on some of the 101s of political strategy and how to deal with an embattled leadership, how to deal with, you know, desperate circumstances? What are some of the top line strategic takeaways from what you've seen over the past week with Annamie Paul, good or bad, I should say?
Carter
9:25
Well, one of the big takeaways, and I think that we forget this sometimes at our peril, is that politics
Carter
9:30
politics is essentially professional wrestling, right?
Carter
9:32
right? You have to have good and bad and evil characters and good characters, and you need to stand in front of the microphone and say things that you want your opponent to react to. You know, a good match isn't just the thing that happens in the ring,
Carter
9:48
right? It's the setup. It's the understanding of the story that's going to happen. And this is a way that the Green Party now gets to have, you know, gets into the ring at least, right? Even if they're just there to be the first ones thrown out in the Royal Rumble. But this is, you know, politics sometimes is just as simple as professional wrestling. You know, who's the heel? Who's the good person? You know, this is recasting the good character as the evil character. You know, I think that it was probably a pretty smart move. move um anime paul comes across as someone who's uh who's
Carter
10:24
who's a fresh face right so a fresh face good person um who can who we don't know well enough to cast as a heel so i think that this was probably
Carter
10:36
if you're just going down to the simplest idea which is am i a good guy or a bad guy who if i'm the good guy then who is the bad guy then this is a probably a pretty good play you're almost almost always going to get attention punching up, especially if the accusation has some degree, just even a little bit of truth to the through line.
Zain
10:57
Yeah, I bring back the classic Stephen Carter, no conflict, no interest line. Stephen Carter, while I have you, before I go to Corey, Triple H or Shawn Michaels?
Carter
11:06
Triple H, Shawn Michaels. Come on, those pants are
Zain
11:08
are too tight. That is the absolute right answer with three-fact Carter. Corey, he's
Zain
11:15
he's actually doing pretty well, Corey. He's
Corey
11:17
He's doing great tonight.
Corey
11:18
I have to say. Our
Corey
11:19
Our boy is doing well tonight. Yeah,
Zain
11:21
Yeah, yeah. This is a Trae Young hot streak that Stephen Carter is on. Corey, talk to me about some of the lessons that the past week with Enemy Pole has perhaps perhaps, exposed, reinforced, highlighted for you around imperiled leadership, strategy, and some of those sort of crisis comms components that we talk about quite often? What, if anything, good or bad has this past week taught you or reinforced for you?
Corey
11:51
It really does, for me, remind what drives
Corey
11:55
drives newsworthiness. And it gets back to some of these communications fundamentals that we often return to because they really do determine
Corey
12:03
determine a lot of how things play out in the last bit but a conflict is going to get the media coming to you and when the media is there if you then propagate further conflict well then you're going to get another couple of stories written about you here because let's be clear it is not the fact that annabelle paul was covered because she was punching up to the prime minister she was covered because Because she has her leadership in peril and everybody wants to know what the hell is going on with that story. And when you've got the press gallery there talking about that, why not take a couple of swings elsewhere and see what you can do and see what kind of drama you can kind of kick out here.
Corey
12:39
The other thing I would say is that sometimes
Corey
12:42
sometimes when you're, especially a third party, shall we say, and your support is registering in single digits, maybe low double digits here. how popular you are and how popular the thing you're saying is there's an interesting interplay there because you don't even need to say the most popular thing for it to be a win you just need to say the thing that enough people agree strongly enough with even if it's say 15 of the population emphatically agrees with you on this particular matter that's more than three times the support the green party has right now so it's an interesting way to mix into the conversation there and it does remind that the dynamics of third party is not always you're looking for a winning issue you're looking for an issue that is a relative win for you right
Zain
13:24
right that maybe has a higher intensity or a coalition that just really fundamentally cares carter speaking of emphatic you're emphatically agreeing with cory i want to let you to jump in there i
Carter
13:33
i think that one of the big problems with both the ndp the greens i think the bloc quebecois actually does it very well because that is their their entire premise they do not require the majority of canadians to agree with them they just need a small percentage of a small province to agree with them and that keeps keeps them elected, keeps them relevant. And I think that if the Green Party were to pick a few 35% issues, I mean, I'm not sure I'd go with 15 because I want to be strong enough, but none of the big parties take 35% issues. And I mean, arguably, that was the foundation of what the Green Party used to be, right? The Green Party used to be fighting for an issue that maybe 30 or 35% of the population thought was important.
Carter
14:18
What has changed is now somewhere in the neighborhood of 65 to 75% of the population think that the environment is important. And they are now allocating those votes to other parties. So the Green Party has lost its raison d'etre. So how do you give it back to them is the opportunity or the challenge if you're the Green Party leader when you're trying to figure out where you fit. Because it's not just good enough to say we needed a good environmental policy. Arguably, all but one party has a good environmental policy. We're now just arguing over degrees.
Zain
14:53
Well, then Carter, talk to me about this before I go back to Corey. If I can summarize the new anime poll issue, it's Justin
Zain
15:00
Justin Trudeau's a fake feminist.
Zain
15:03
She's trying to, you know, align Jody Wilson-Raybould with her. She's trying to to align uh the former mp from the liberals uh selena she's as part of her coalition all three bipoc women do you feel like that's if i can call it cory's 15 plus issue do you feel like that could be enough uh to to kind of not make her relevant but is that is that better than where the greens are standing right now to go back to the fundamentals well
Carter
15:29
well i don't know i mean am i am i going to get in trouble if i if i call this some sort of uh you
Carter
15:34
you know if i say that this is an an opportunity, and this is kind of a new opportunity for kind of woke feminism that is, it's not your mother's type of feminism. It is a new feminism of people that are going to stand up and kind of make more stringent demands, kind of pushing us further than where we are today, this kind of comfortable feminism that Justin Trudeau represents. I think that this could be an opportunity for her. I think this is a thing that she can take that is not available to Jagmeet Singh, who may want other pieces of like AOC's legacy. But this is also part of that legacy, you know, women standing up and saying, this is what we're going to do. And I think that she can own that in a way that none of the other party leaders obviously can. So I think that this is probably an opportunity for the Green Party if they wish to go there. I think there's an open question as to whether or not the governors of the Green Party or the board of directors of the the Green Party want to go there. But as the leader, this is an interesting opportunity that does kind of represent, I don't know what the numbers on it are, 25%, 30%, 35%, 4%. I don't know. But it does feel like it'd be something I'd want to test on for sure.
Zain
16:50
Corey, instinctively, because I can just ask you instinctively, not, you know, to Carter's point, without evidence, but does this feel like an issue that might have a coalition that polls above where the greens stand right now yeah
Corey
17:02
yeah it does although i am i am of two minds on this one of them is this is the green party it's right there in the name it exists for environmental causes right the social causes are are
Corey
17:14
are important but perhaps not encompassed by that overall umbrella and it would be a bit of a weird admission
Corey
17:19
admission that perhaps some of the green look i'm
Corey
17:22
i'm not saying they're going to give up being an environmental party but if you
Corey
17:26
make the next election about bringing
Corey
17:28
bringing a more forthright, more honest, more modern version of feminism forward than what Justin Trudeau has offered.
Corey
17:36
That's a little weird when you're the Green Party, right? On the other hand, I do think that there is something there. And, you know, it's hard to ignore the fact that BIPOC women have not felt particularly comfortable within the Liberal Party of canada and yeah
Corey
17:54
yeah that's probably an area of vulnerability and an opportunity to pick up votes so maybe
Corey
18:00
maybe it's as simple as that maybe it's as simple as surviving but it does seem to be a bit of a drift from their philosophical mission now arguably not arguably all of these politics and issues are intertwined in ways you know feminism green
Corey
18:13
green politics many people have made the case that there is naturally got to come to alignment there but it doesn't i
Corey
18:21
think the public might have trouble sort of saying yeah that's the social justice party because they're the green
Zain
18:28
yeah that's a new but don't you think the leader defines that cory to that to that extent like the her background and lived experience so to speak i
Corey
18:36
do and so this is where i i do say i'm a little bit torn but and
Corey
18:41
and it's not like the capital l liberal party is liberal in the definition of liberal that it was originally understood when it was created nor is the conservative party conservative in the context that it was when it was created people take these names and then they go and do their own things over time but i i don't know i still think that the environmental movement is so tied up in the green party's identity the difference is the liberals govern the conservatives governed they did these things for a while and they evolved as the political environment evolved but has there ever been a more important moment for green politics than right now But
Carter
19:13
this is my problem with it, though. The green politics, you're making it sound like there's only one party that's actually pushing forward a green agenda. And I think that all the parties, save one, are pushing a green agenda. Now, the only argument is, how far are they pushing and are they pushing fast enough? And I don't think that that's enough for the Green Party just to stand on. it's not you know having
Carter
19:38
having not reached a point where they governed like they did in germany i mean it just feels to me like if you don't reach the point where you're going to govern then what's the point like you're not really changing anything because you've already changed so much by putting this into the into the popular zeitgeist everybody must have a plank in their platform we're dealing with the environment we're now just dealing with degrees cory
Corey
20:01
cory this is the the only party that exists to push a green agenda that's the big difference here now
Corey
20:06
now again all that said i
Corey
20:09
can't think of a time in the past two years we've talked about the green party this long and so maybe this is fruitful ground uh now not all good right we're also talking about a serious challenge to leadership we're talking about floor crossings but interestingly enough the bulk of what we've talked about right now has been the
Corey
20:26
the attack on justin trudeau is it fair is it not fair. And so maybe in some ways, that makes the case in micro for what she's doing. But
Corey
20:36
I don't know, man, I don't know. Yeah,
Zain
20:38
Yeah, I mean, in some ways, this is probably the conversation the Greens wish people were having, you know, barring the tone about it, which is that, you know, a party that stands for the green agenda, but also has a leader with, you know, an intersectional sort of past and sort of lived experience that this is exactly it, They can fight on social justice. They can fight on BIPOC. They can fight on social issues as well as own the green and push the green agenda for all political parties. I guess, Carter, where it boils down to me then, for me, I should say, is,
Zain
21:08
is, you know, is this just a short-term strategy to save one's leadership? Or do you feel like this has got long-term legs, right? I think that's what we're fundamentally discussing here, which is, is this a clever band-aid? And I think both of you have said yes-ish to that. Or does this have legs beyond that as a positioning that she may have just accidentally discovered while trying to issue these haymakers to survive? And I think that's what I'm intrigued about as she continues with the upcoming weeks and days. And maybe what I'll position to you, Carter, is will this work? Will this work on the short-term goal of saving her leadership? I mean, the knives are out. The vote has been delayed. The former leader hasn't vocalized her support for enemy Paul. What do you think? From what you're seeing right now, does enemy Paul survive as leader of the Green Party?
Carter
21:58
i'm a i'm a child of the 80s right so you guys know that you know back in the 80s we had these merger and acquisition poison pills where companies would put a poison pill into their you know into their structure and if someone tried to take them over essentially it would destroy the value of the company this feels to me like it has the ability to be a bit of a poison pill um that if they continue to come after anime paul now uh they are running you know they being the Board of Governors or the Board of Directors of the Green Party, they're running into a potential trap because they're going to be accused. I mean, and I think rightfully so. I don't remember. I mean, I don't remember Elizabeth May's leadership being all that great. Call me crazy if you want, but I think that she was an absolutely passable leader. And the moment that Anna May Paul comes in or like less than a year later, they're already gunning for her through her leadership. I'm not a big fan of it. And I don't think that they should just get away with it. So this is a an opportunity to go after the liberals for something that may in fact be happening to her. And I think that this is a, you know, a poison pill that the Green Party needs to be very careful about. I'm not sure it's going to work in the long term. I'm not even sure it's going to work in the short term. But I do think that there's a little bit of strategic genius to it. Nonetheless, nonetheless.
Zain
23:14
Corey, I'll let you go. Carter, I need to have you explain the poison pill. How is it a poison pill? I don't know if I caught on.
Carter
23:20
Because I think that if they go after her, they're going to be accused of throwing a very talented woman of color out of
Carter
23:29
when they put up with a very mediocre white woman for so long.
Zain
23:34
So you feel like this kind of gives her impunity in some ways. Is that what I'm hearing you
Carter
23:38
you say? I think if I was writing the strategy for it, I'd say that this could give her impunity.
Carter
23:43
Whether or not it does is an open question. I think that this is them trying to write a poison pill.
Zain
23:50
Corey, respond to what you heard from Carter, and then as well as your take on does this save her leadership, what we've seen from her over the past week?
Corey
23:57
Well, it's an interesting metaphor, but
Corey
23:59
but I don't know who Michael Milken is in this situation, right? Who is the corporate raider who is trying to take over the party? What makes this situation so interesting to me steven is exactly what you just said which is this
Corey
24:11
this is a woman of color that they're looking to turn over after less than a year in the leadership yeah or the members of the governing party i shouldn't say this is a universal feeling of the greens they
Corey
24:21
they absolutely must know what the optics of that are they
Corey
24:24
they absolutely must know what they are i
Carter
24:26
i think they're so politically naive sometimes well
Corey
24:30
don't know i mean we are also talking about like Like Annamie Paul in this press conference was saying, why won't the liberals be champions of the Green Party effectively? So political naivety seems to be in full swing there. But I
Corey
24:44
don't – I think that what to me is telling me she will not likely be the leader in the not-too-distant future is the fact that they looked at that situation. They did the analysis that you're doing because, listen, I love you, my man, but that is not genius analysis. Anybody could look at that situation and say, that's pretty fucking dicey. And they decided to take this path anyhow.
Corey
25:06
And you think they're going to
Zain
25:07
to pursue it to its end?
Corey
25:09
Well, it tells me things are pretty bad in the Green Party right now. And if that's the situation, I
Corey
25:15
I don't know. I don't know why you would want to hold on if you're leader. later but
Zain
25:19
but carter do you do you feel like the greens if they do that they get rid of her that the poison pill is real to extend your your analogy that it actually works or do you feel like it's a placebo i
Carter
25:32
think they'll be done really
Carter
25:34
really i think they'll be you think you think the party really well
Carter
25:38
well who's going to come in i mean leaders are supposed to lead board of governors are supposed to govern board of directors are supposed to direct like this is not you know know the leader is supposed to take the party where it's supposed to go it is not it is an uneasy alliance at all times between the boards of a political party and the leader's office of a political party every leader's office has conflict with every uh board structure
Carter
26:01
structure the it just is reality you know the the the party wants to have more control over nominating candidates the the leader wants more control over nominating candidates i mean uh the leader's office wants more money to spend. They've got expenses. There's always something. That type of conflict rarely degenerates to the place where the
Carter
26:24
the board is in some fashion trying to get rid of the leader. That rarely happens.
Zain
26:31
Corey, I'm going to end on this, which is Carter gave me this answer through his analysis earlier. But if you were strategizing for anime paul the
Zain
26:40
the person right like current leader of the green party but anime paul what would you be telling her right now you know would you would you say there's a model for her to follow in the footsteps of a jody wilson raybould or you know would you say just double down on this uh what would what are some of the strategic lessons you'd be telling her knowing what she's been through over the past week i
Corey
27:02
would say there's an awful lot of people in this party who are are uncomfortable with change the type of necessary change that will bring the green party from a fringe party to a relevant force in canadian politics and what you're seeing here is the inevitable consequence
Corey
27:15
consequence of that and yeah
Corey
27:17
yeah i i am deeply concerned about how some of them treat or interact with a woman of color i absolutely am but the bigger message here is i am going to change the green party for the better we are going to be bringing this conversation to the the forefront in canadian politics and if the people are if the current members of the board are uncomfortable with that i encourage them to go find another organization to be a part of because we are not going to step down from taking this path forward is
Zain
27:42
is there is there any quit for you is there any um time that that if if if it gets stacked against you that you're just like your your best strategic move is to is to leave walk away do your own thing or kind of burn it to the
Zain
27:56
what's that point for you for
Corey
27:58
for me that is for starters maybe well is jagmeet singh giving me a call because maybe i can burn it down go to the ndp become deputy leader there become
Corey
28:09
become heir apparent of the ndp larger organization bring this together and you
Corey
28:13
you want to talk poison pills you can burn this fucker to the ground if you want to so it
Carter
28:18
it barely exists it's just a couple of you know it's
Carter
28:23
it's always barely existed it just doesn't have the strength that it can it can handle this type of internal strife let's
Zain
28:30
let's leave that there excellent segment guys let's move it on to our next segment our next segment reopen roundup cory this is your third favorite thing after the governor general conversation and vaccine doses i want to talk about a reba openings across the country well mainly in two areas uh alberta july 1st the lottery worked steven and carter uh we are we are we are open to i think it's called phase three right guys uh phase three
Zain
28:55
phase three comes july 1st all restrictions are lifted and following in our footsteps the date of july 11th for saskatchewan but we also have another date i want to i want to bat around which is july 23rd which is the extension of the u.s canada border now being closed by the federal government in concert with uh the the u.s gonna get a pulse check from you guys What do you think of Alberta and Saskatchewan, one and two, so to speak, on opening up? Carter, we've done this in the past. We've kind of asked you, what do you think? The Delta variants have an additional story or the more chapters are being written on there. Are you changing your take from last time around bad idea to good idea this time in terms of what's happening here in Alberta and perhaps simultaneously what's going to happen 10 days later in Saskatchewan? What do you think?
Carter
29:44
Still a bad idea.
Carter
29:46
Love where the numbers are. Absolutely am in love with it. I'm obviously disappointed that our first doses have kind of plateaued at 70%. You know, it'd be amazing if we could get them over 80% here in Alberta, 80, 85%, 90%. That's really where we should be targeting. And then the
Carter
30:09
the Delta variant is a real thing. I don't know how real. I don't know that it's going to ultimately, you know, do that exponential growth thing that we have seen now uh several times in the past uh with our third wave being being our worst um just
Carter
30:25
just a few months ago um but
Carter
30:28
but i i just think you know just
Carter
30:30
just give me one just give me one more month right
Carter
30:34
right july 1st just feels like we're just leaping like if you look at ontario you look at quebec you look at british columbia they've done a four-step process right the third step is is just a little bit further
Carter
30:46
further along and it doesn't go from you can have 20 people in your backyard to literally no rules it just feels to me like right now the three of us can't record the podcast in in one room that that is against the rules on july the first the three of us can have a live audience of 300 people listening to us in a very small room that's fine there's no rules so it just feels like we go from nothing to the next thing immediately and for me um
Carter
31:20
just would like i'd like another month just give me one more month to make sure that everything is going to be okay thank you premier ford that makes more sense to me cory
Zain
31:29
cory reopen roundup uh july 1st alberta july 11th saskatchewan i said 23rd for the borders. It's the 21st, just so I can clarify. But let's talk about the first two. You called it, your analogy was driving fast on a windy mountainous road, if I'm not mistaken. Do you still believe in that analogy?
Corey
31:47
I do. But the longer you go down that road, the less road that's in front of you, just by math, the less dangerous it is here. And the reality is
Corey
31:56
at the start, I was quite concerned about the fact that we were leaning everything on first doses and ignoring second doses. But because it's taken us a bit longer to get to where we wanted to be with first doses, we've
Corey
32:07
we've hit those marks on second doses already, where PHAC essentially said we needed to be to start opening up. And I think when you start looking at other jurisdictions, including the UK, where they have this Delta variant going through, there is reason to be quite hopeful because hospitalizations and deaths are not following, even though the case numbers are going up. And there is a future that is possible of coronavirus where it's a cold. In fact, many colds are caused by coronaviruses. And I'm not saying it's a cold. Let me be really clear here. I'm not saying it's the sniffles. You got COVID and you go back to work. But we may be at a point where it becomes less lethal. It becomes more managed. Many of us, as we get our doses and second doses, will have immunity to it. it. And just as with the flu every year, even though you get your flu shot, you got to get another flu shot. The flu is not likely to kill us. We may end up in a situation like that. And there's some data that suggests that. But the thing I really want to make sure we get on the table here is,
Corey
33:06
is, yes, we tend to look across at BC and Ontario, and we sometimes look at them and say, hey, our first dose numbers have plateaued a little sooner than them. But it's really important and it's worth noting, especially in the context of border reopenings here. Alberta has higher First dose uptake than California, than Oregon, than Portland, than New York, way higher than Texas, way, way higher than Wyoming or Idaho, states like that. And we're
Corey
33:32
we're doing pretty damn well. So if the border is sort of safe to open, it's the other side I'm worried about, frankly, it's no longer any
Corey
33:39
any Canadian jurisdiction I'm that fussed about when we start talking about the border opening. me.
Zain
33:44
Let's talk about the politics of the border in a second. Carter, let's talk about Kenny here and the political gamble, because last time we talked about this, which I think was two to three weeks ago, we said that Kenny was waging a lot on this, that this was, you know, a leader who didn't do great, at least according to the polling numbers during the pandemic, but putting a lot of his chips on the reopening, the first to reopen, wearing that badge, wearing that medal across the country seem to be a critical part of his brand and what he was waging. It seems like he's going to be, all things considered. Do you feel like that political bet's about to pay off here for Jason Kenney?
Carter
34:21
It could pay off. I still think, I mean, what did we equate it to? Putting it all on red on the roulette wheel? I
Carter
34:29
I think you used an analogy similar
Carter
34:31
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, mean i'm still thinking he's putting it all on red um i i don't know even now with
Zain
34:37
with with what we've seen and and and the runway that cory's talked about that uh that we've traveled so to speak sure
Carter
34:43
sure we're doing great we're
Carter
34:45
we're doing great isn't the same as we're out of the woods right like this is why i'm saying like i don't disagree with what cory's saying i don't disagree that we should start opening up i the difference is the language the language was used we should start start opening up. We are not, no one ever said, if you get the 30% second doses and 70% first doses, Bob's
Carter
35:08
Bob's your uncle. Do whatever you want. That's what we've got here. And so the start opening up, I'm totally on board. Let's start opening up. You know, let us make sure that we are doing things wisely. Calgary City Council tomorrow is debating whether or not they should end their mask mandate.
Carter
35:24
You know, I don't know about you guys. They can do whatever the hell all they want with the mask mandate. I'm still wearing a mask because I don't know yet. I'm not comfortable yet. And so I'm just going to just, it doesn't cost me anything, right? No one's looking at me. No one's going to be angry with me. I'll just put the mask on. I'll walk around for the four seconds that I'm in the shopping mall or buying my groceries. And then I'll go back out and, you know, enjoy the summer outside, which is something everybody should do who's listening to this start opening up kenny has put all of it on red i think he's probably it's moved from a 50 50 probability to something more like a 75 chance that things are going to be fine but
Carter
36:06
but i don't know and you know the the headlines coming out of uh out of great britain make me nervous the delta variant makes me nervous but i'm not going to be standing around here and predicting chaos i don't know what's going to happen i just would like a little bit more time but carter Carter,
Zain
36:24
if I gave you a political strategy on a silver platter that had a three out of four chance of succeeding and having a big payoff, if it was not this COVID issue, you would take it in any other situation, wouldn't you?
Carter
36:37
No, I mean, 75% percentage, I try and hit, I mean, if you're, one of the reasons I don't like the swing for this is a, you're forgetting about the consequence, right?
Corey
36:47
So it's 75%. It's the other part. No,
Zain
36:50
No, I understand. This is what I'm trying to say is that is it COVID explicitly that's making you balk at a 75% to your analysis, a 75% hit rate for a strategy? I
Carter
36:59
I was talking to a candidate yesterday about the idea of small ball versus swinging for the fences. So this is Kenny swinging for the fences. He's now got a 75% chance of maybe hitting the ball over the fence, right? Whatever. It might be okay. okay. But if he doesn't, he
Carter
37:15
he is absolutely screwed. The consequence of the 25% is a massive, massive problem for him. If you're just doing things small ball, if you just go after things one step at a time, then the consequence never gets out of hand. You're able to manage the political risk in a much, much more manageable basis.
Carter
37:35
Kenny's taking an enormous political risk. He is putting his entire future on that 75%. And I'm not sure, guys, if your job hinged on 75% probability of success, would you do it? I'm not sure I would do it. You know, if your job depended on it, if the chance that you could remain premier, I'm
Carter
37:56
I'm not sure any of us would take that risk.
Zain
37:59
Corey, pick it up from there from what you heard from Carter.
Corey
38:02
I think that Carter is right about the downside. side i
Corey
38:06
i absolutely disagree it's 25 i think we're talking one percent less than one percent maybe two but
Corey
38:14
but i'm just sort of picking numbers my point is it seems fairly remote as a risk right now
Corey
38:20
i still would caution the premier against saying things like we're open for good that seems like you've created
Corey
38:25
a problem for you in the future if we do find ourselves in a situation where a variant causes closing again those words can be thrown back in your face pretty quickly and i just don't think the comms win was worth the potential comms downside but really we are talking about probabilities at this point and
Corey
38:42
and it does seem to me that while alberta is opening aggressively
Corey
38:47
is probably going to work out and as time passes it seems more likely that it is going to work out you know stephen talked about say
Corey
38:55
say what you will i'm still wearing a mask
Corey
38:58
this we're at a weird moment in covet i don't want to argue should you wear a mask should you not wear a mask. That's a personal choice at a certain point. It is the law right now in Calgary at this point. It is the law in the province until July 1st. But we are going to hit a moment where you don't need to do those things anymore. And you say, for example, Stephen, I'm still wearing a mask. Well, I
Corey
39:19
I was thinking as you're saying that, well, would I? Why would I? I've
Corey
39:23
I've got two doses of vaccine.
Corey
39:25
In other jurisdictions, you don't require a mask when you've got two doses.
Corey
39:29
There is going to be a point where we're all going to have to kind of move on. I don't have two doses.
Corey
39:35
Oh, well, you should get that second. I'm
Carter
39:38
I'm going to get that done, but I don't have it done yet. This is my point, right?
Carter
39:42
75% of us don't have that second dose.
Corey
39:45
But this is my point because I'm trying to make the broader point, which is at
Corey
39:51
a certain point, it will be as done as it's going to be. Maybe I'll put it that way because I don't think that we are ever going to vanquish COVID at this point.
Corey
39:59
And it is going to be something that we're going to manage. and we're going to have to come out of our homes and we're going to have to go on to our lives. And I'm sort of excited to go to restaurants. I was walking by one on the street where I live and I was thinking, God,
Corey
40:10
God, I can't wait to go there. Yeah, I was picking up food from it. And I just thought, man, it'd be nice to go on that patio. And I know it's kind of dumb and it's kind of small, but it's
Corey
40:18
it's been a year and a half. And at a certain point, we are going to have to move on. And I think that there's a lot of Albertans who feel how I feel about that. And so I don't think it's going to be a political loss for the premier. there. I truly don't.
Corey
40:32
I agree that there is still that risk, and I do worry about the downside from a probability point of view, but politically,
Corey
40:39
politically, it's likely to pay off.
Zain
40:41
Carter, talk to me about this. How should the NDP in Alberta be playing this right now?
Zain
40:47
If it's anywhere between your 25% and Corey's 1% to 2%, right? Let's just say that it's on the lower side. It's on the minority side rather than the majority side that this will uh not pay off then what is the what is the tax or what's the overall strategic makeup of the nds right now don't
Carter
41:04
don't bet on the 25 right
Carter
41:06
right whatever you're the if you're the new democrats don't bet on the failure right you've got to be hopeful and optimistic um i think you can say you know the key to this whole thing is getting as many people double vaccinated as possible right now we're going to be everybody who wants to be double vaccinated is going to be double vaccinated by the end of july that there is a method to my madness for saying just give me one more month the one more month gets us to exactly what cory's talking about that place where we are managing covid where the people who have got the vaccine have taken the vaccine anybody wants it's got it and everybody's going to be impacted you know i'll have mine you'll have yours everybody will be ready and and there may be some people who still get a little bit sick, but it won't be nearly the same. Um, science will have saved us from ourselves. And that
Carter
41:56
that is, is, is only one month out from this. It's only three or four weeks after the premier opens us up on July the 1st. So probably your best bet is just keep quiet and don't bet on the 25%. Don't make sure, you know, just because the other guy's got all his money on red doesn't mean you have to put all your money on black good
Zain
42:18
point uh cory do you want to add anything to that what as to what the alberta new democrats need to do as official opposition here when
Corey
42:25
it comes to covid i think
Corey
42:26
think they're doing what we're seeing them doing right now which is applauding the victory but trying to take the victory away from the premier trying to give it to the people of alberta right saying this is this is because of all of you this is because you followed this uh and that's i think that's because they're doing a similar calculation to the one that i just laid out which is people are going to like this they're going to like that alberta is more open up and that they're able to go on with their lives uh come july and perhaps they'll even think positively about it relative to say ontario and british columbia where that will not be the case so i i thought carter again i disagree with him about the odds i don't think it's 75 i you know the red and black for me doesn't work it's more like jason
Corey
43:08
jason kenney's got got red and black covered, and he's hoping zero doesn't come up. But either way, don't bet on zero.
Zain
43:16
Corey, let's talk about the borders. July 21st extended. The shift in policy at the border comes as many Canadian provinces have hit the key vaccination targets, with more than 75% of eligible Canadians receiving at least one dose and 20% receiving two. We hear today that the Americans have actually agreed. There's been some calls in the US to unilaterally open up down south, but I don't
Corey
43:37
don't know. Very American.
Zain
43:38
Yeah, very American. The U.S. has agreed until the 21st for a re-examination. We're hearing also that full restrictions at the border dropped when 75% have both doses. What do you think of the politics of this for the Trudeau government? They're getting hit on both sides of the border, so to speak. They're getting hit politically on this. Is this something that should just remain steadfast in, or do you see political downside side here in terms of the politics of reopening and the caution that they're employing here
Corey
44:08
know america has handled covid so differently than canada and i would argue so badly compared to canada even now as they reopen and we see them you
Corey
44:18
know we we were talking about basketball earlier yeah
Zain
44:21
full arenas oh my god like the sun's arena was packed today no
Corey
44:25
no it's crazy and these i was already saying like a lot of these jurisdictions their best first dose coverage is below our worst first dose coverage it's
Corey
44:34
it's not it's not like they just did it so well ahead of us here even with their head start they're not that much ahead of us in the number of doses per hundred thousand and they are well behind us in first doses at this point and
Corey
44:47
and so i guess i say all of this to say
Corey
44:51
i'm not real wild about remixing with the americans
Corey
44:54
americans on this particular matter i'm not and maybe that's not fair to them but idaho
Corey
44:59
idaho for example border state montana border state Those are some low, low first-dose COVID numbers. And
Corey
45:06
And I worry about just
Corey
45:07
just the odds of bringing it in, especially when we're at a time where, lest
Corey
45:11
lest we forget, children age 0 to 11 cannot get COVID vaccines. I have three that fall within that category. And I would still absolutely like to – let's just say I trust the Canadian adult population not to spread the virus, thanks to our uptake of vaccines, a lot more than I trust the American population. So if there's the ability to sort of ensure vaccination, at least one dose from some of these visitors, I would feel much more comfortable, ideally two doses. I don't think it's an unreasonable prerequisite to travel, frankly, even between provinces that you get vaccinated.
Corey
45:47
But we'll see if the government has the confidence to do that. I worry about what that may introduce. produce.
Zain
45:52
Carter, talk to me about the politics here. July 21st, now mutually agreed upon. Can the Trudeau government get hit here to a meaningful degree on their level of caution on border reopening?
Carter
46:04
I don't think so. I think that for all the reasons that Corey is talking about, you know, the U.S. has not been a reliable partner on this. So that makes me nervous. I agree with Corey. I'm not super stoked with counting on the adult population of the United States to be be responsible. But I do think that we need to reopen the border at some point. And the
Carter
46:26
the 21st of July, I mean, you know, we can argue about my August 1st date or the July 21st date. It's not that much different. And the Trudeau government is going to be, by the 21st of July, there's going to be a declaration of victory here in Canada. We're going to have a significant number of Canadians with two vaccines. In fact, we might be over, well, we're over 75 nationwide on first doses, 75%. We may be over 80% on first doses and over 50% on second.
Carter
47:01
And by any measure, that's
Carter
47:03
that's going to be successful when you think back to what the Conservatives were crying about in February and March.
Zain
47:11
Let's move it on to our next segment. Our next segment, summarizing silly season. Guys, the House of Commons is becoming increasingly dysfunctional this past week. We saw opposition MPs vote to censure Defence Minister Harjit Sajjan. Liberals are filibustering the House of Commons Defence Committee. Opposition parties are stalling the government's Broadcasting Act, C-10. The Conservative leader has pulled his MPs from a special national security committee, accusing the government of using it as a cover-up incident that caused two scientists at Canada's high-security laboratory to be fired. And just this week, Trudeau accused opposition parties of engaging in toxicity and political games, not to count the two press conferences by Annamie Paul this week, as we discussed. Things are getting stupid at the House of Commons. Things are getting silly.
Zain
47:56
silly. Carter, I wanted mainly, you know, we could talk about this and editorialize this to the end. What is the strategy for political parties in these last weeks of summer in the House as it relates to setting up a good trajectory for the upcoming, let's just assume it's coming, the upcoming election. Is the House do anything for that? Like, are these political games actually helpful in setting up, you know, as I say, the trajectory for how you position yourself there on? And that's the main thing I want to focus on. We can get into each of the items at some point if you'd like. But I'm just really wondering, which of these political games, if we want to call it that, work and which don't work to try to set up a better position for yourself come this August slash September, October?
Carter
48:41
The House of Commons, I think, is always always a gold mine of fool's gold where everybody thinks that they're mining real gold and that it's going to to have long-term impacts because look at all this stuff that's
Carter
48:53
that's happening in the in in the house of commons and look how we're taking it to them look at how we're dominating in the house of commons we're dominating in committee we're
Carter
49:02
we're dominating them we're holding them to account right i i think that the problem is that that's
Carter
49:08
that's not anybody else's experience right for For most voters, for most people who are involved in politics at kind of a marginal level where they care about it at an election time, and for the rest of the time, they're just trying to get by, which is the vast majority of Canadians, vast majority of anybody in democracy.
Carter
49:29
It doesn't matter, right?
Carter
49:30
right? It's not even theater. It's maybe theater for those of us that are paying attention. It's maybe theater for the media. It's maybe theater for each other, but
Carter
49:40
but it is certainly not theater that is reaching the masses. It's the equivalent of, you know, an opera in Italian. There's a small group of people that really enjoy the opera in Italian, and the rest of us are just like, what the fuck just happened? And
Carter
49:54
me, is the House of Commons at this particular moment in time.
Zain
49:58
Corey, is any of this, from what I've read or anything else, useful to set up election trajectories, to set up ballot box questions, to set up, you know, political and campaign strategy? Or is this, to what Carter calls Italian opera, not really useful in any of what we might see in August, September, October?
Corey
50:19
me tell you a story.
Corey
50:21
What seems like a lifetime ago, I worked for the Liberal Party of Canada. You both know that. I don't know how many of our listeners know that. And I remember going to Ottawa from Calgary for a couple of weeks of meetings and just getting really caught up in the drama of the place. This is happening. This person is talking to this person. This is who's allied with that person internally and externally in the party, all of that.
Corey
50:43
And I remember very distinctly getting on the plane, going
Corey
50:47
going back to Calgary. And it just almost as I left the airspace of Ottawa, it washing off me being like, what the hell was all of that?
Corey
50:56
What the hell was that? And I guess my point is you are seeing method and I see only madness. sadness these are hard bloody jobs where you talk only
Corey
51:05
only to the people that do the same bloody job as you on the main and people get really stupid near the end and i'm not being critical of them they're yeah they're working long hours and they're in this pressure cooker and they their feedback loops are you
Corey
51:20
you know they're they're drinking their own piss here it's it's just it's all it's all looped together. It's a closed cycle here. And anybody
Corey
51:29
anybody who's worked in politics, whether that be provincial, whether that be federal, I can tell you from both, people
Corey
51:35
people get stupid near the end of a session. People get punchy. That's when mistakes are made. That's when people go off script. That's when ministers say wild things. That's when opposition MLAs say wild things. That's when the speaker says something that is perceived as wild or is used to clamp down on all of the while that's when there's tears from staffers that's when there are people who make you know shouting matches in the halls a normal uh normal normal thing and people
Corey
52:02
people just need to go at a certain point and you start seeing the house leaders realize that and negotiate like let's just let's just jam this through tonight let's get the fuck out of here and
Corey
52:11
it's for two reasons one is they need to return to the real world they
Corey
52:15
they need to return to the real world for things to start making sense and to start fighting about things that matter again and so i'm a big enthusiast for politicians having lots of break weeks to go back and get earfuls from their constituents about what actually matters and i think they i think they should be frankly mandatory if you're an mp for an area you go back there for a week and you have to walk your your area and sort of understand that but the other is people need breaks and we live in this kind of bullshit hustle culture world where where everybody brags about working 16-hour days, you
Corey
52:45
you can't do that forever. And when these people, a lot of the staffers are in their 20s, early 30s, when they're doing this, they
Corey
52:53
they start to fray, and they start to make mistakes, and they start to blow it. And that's also true of the people who are elected as well. And so you
Corey
53:01
gave a big list of things. This isn't strategy to go to an election. This is a bunch of overworked people who have dome disease, who just need to get the hell out of dodge i don't think any of this helps anybody um now interestingly on that list i think there's an awful lot more where the liberals have screwed up they probably need this more than anybody getting out of there but uh yeah there's no method at this point it's summer it's
Corey
53:27
it's time for people to go home let's
Zain
53:29
let's leave that segment there move it on to our final segment our over under in our lightning round steven carter i do this for you and i do do this for you alone, my friend.
Carter
53:39
You're the best, Zane. No
Zain
53:40
No problem. Stephen Carter, overrated or underrated? Opposition MPs vote to censure Defense Minister Harjit Sajjan. Overrated or underrated?
Carter
53:52
who's going to pay attention? Is this something that is going to matter in the nationwide campaign that we're all anticipating? Absolutely not.
Zain
54:01
Corey, same question to you. Overrated or underrated? Opposition MPs vote to censure defense minister hajit sajan for his dealing with uh the the military if i can call it debacle
Corey
54:11
yeah the censure itself is overrated no question about that in my mind these things used to mean an awful lot it used to be like oh my god a censure remember when presidents in the united states prime ministers in canada they tried to avoid censures now nobody gives a damn
Corey
54:26
think sajan is a weak link for the liberals i think the military is a huge problem for them
Corey
54:33
I'm not sure that that goes to the benefit of Aaron O'Toole, I'm
Corey
54:37
I'm not as convinced as Stephen that this isn't something we'll be talking about on the campaign trail.
Zain
54:42
Corey, I'm going to stick with you for our next one. Justin Trudeau is saying that vaccine deliveries will be enough to fully vaccinate all eligible Canadians by the end of July. The Liberals and the government have secured enough vaccines to fully vaccinate all Canadians by the end of July. Is that overrated or underrated in your mind?
Corey
55:01
I think at this point, Canadians were almost sort of expecting something close to that timeline. We should step back, though, and remind ourselves of what the conversation was like in January, in February, how it just seemed like we were not going to get everybody. Well, some people were saying, I will remind you that I was not saying this, but many people were saying, we're not going to get everybody vaccinated into well into next year at the pace we're going at the trajectories that we can anticipate in terms of both the public health apparatus to get people injected, but also the delivery schedule. So this is amazing.
Corey
55:37
We had a disease.
Corey
55:39
We had a vaccine in months.
Corey
55:41
months. That vaccine was then tested through those three stages of testing within further months. And here we are. It was December that these things were approved. And by July, we're
Corey
55:53
we're going to have had, what,
Corey
55:56
what, 50 million doses delivered to people?
Corey
55:59
That's totally unreal. real that's 68 68
Zain
56:02
million doses by the end of july uh stephen carter i'm going to ask you the same question overrated underrated uh the trudeau government uh ensuring enough vaccine deliveries to fully vaccinate all eligible canadians by the end of july underrated
Carter
56:15
underrated i mean we forget how quickly we were just talking we were talking about one dose summer uh only six weeks ago six weeks ago we were talking about a one dose summer and now basically everybody who wants it is going to have have a second dose in July. I mean, this is massive. The field has shifted very, very quickly, and people will be able to return to their normally scheduled lives, as Corey has described. I've been a little bit more skeptical. What we're talking about right now, the difference between my skepticism and Corey's optimism, is a period of about four weeks. That is just not a significant amount of time when one thinks about where we have been uh to end up in this situation where we have uh vaccines for everybody who wants them uh we will soon be talking about what to do with the vaccine you know the people who don't want vaccines what a great place to be hey
Zain
57:12
hey carter tell me this uh one dose summer did the true does this true liberals look smart like setting expectations so low or still just a bad idea or even even with hindsight it's a fucking stupid idea okay
Zain
57:25
what no summer any merit and now looking better because they uh they exceeded expectations uh
Corey
57:31
little some i guess i have to say some i still think it was on net not worth it and a bad idea and the bad brand yeah
Corey
57:38
yeah who's thinking that nobody was calling out for that brand and it was so obviously an intended brand but yeah i mean because it it was a bit sticky mickey we remember it we talk about one dose summer and now it's not a one dose summer so yeah
Corey
57:54
yeah but we don't equate it
Carter
57:54
it to liberals we're
Carter
57:55
we're not giving them the win the same way like they set themselves up like
Carter
58:00
like they they should if they'd done nothing they would have looked better than if they then what doing what they did really
Corey
58:06
really i agree with you you think so i agree with you like i think i think that there is a bit of um a
Corey
58:12
bit of cool guys don't look at explosions on this but also they over-corrected on this. They managed too far. They managed expectations too far on this.
Zain
58:21
Yeah, right, right, right, which has a downside. Carter, I'm going to stick with you on this. U.S. politicians fuming over Canada's extended border restrictions. Now they've joined us, of course, but their rage and outrage on the other side of the border, overrated or underrated?
Carter
58:38
Overrated, I don't care. The United States being angry with us at this particular moment in time, I think that all of us were looking at what was going on in the U.S. over the last, frankly, five years. I mean, COVID has just been the last year and a half of lunacy.
Carter
58:55
We're not looking to them for leadership. Even with Biden going to Europe in the G7 last week, trying
Carter
59:03
trying to reassert himself as the world's leader. Yeah, you can try. We're
Carter
59:09
We're not following. following
Zain
59:11
he was there with canada's dean of the g7 justin trudeau uh uh
Zain
59:17
uh cory overrated underrated u.s politicians fuming over canada's extended border restrictions
Corey
59:25
couldn't even begin to unpack that and decide whether it's overrated or underrated i will say it is the kind of thing that immediately gets canadians to be less sympathetic to your cause u.s politicians that you feel entitled to this border being open in. So not that anybody is going to take that advice, but if U.S. politicians want us to move faster on the border, they
Corey
59:45
they should not push us on the border.
Zain
59:48
Corey, I'm going to stick with you. Yes or no, enemy Paul is the leader of the Green Party heading into our next federal election?
Corey
59:55
that is a good question.
Corey
59:56
I am going to say no.
Zain
1:00:01
Stephen Carter, same question. Yes or no, enemy Paul is the leader of the Green Party heading into our next federal election? She
Zain
1:00:08
Fantastic. Can you use that in a full sentence so Corey could clip that?
Carter
1:00:11
that? She will be the leader in the next federal election. It's going to be called in late August. Write it down.
Zain
1:00:17
Full name. We need a full name. She doesn't help us for this. Anna May Paul will
Zain
1:00:22
will be the leader. Jesus Christ. So difficult. Whatever, Carter. Whatever. Carter, I'm going to stick with you for the final one. Give me the one sentence strategy for how Jason Kenney should celebrate. are bright. The political strategy, July 1, Canada Day, Alberta will be open, restrictions being dropped. What is the political strategy for Jason Kenney, the one-sentence strategy for the Canada Day opening? What is it?
Carter
1:00:46
Picnic on a balcony with a 40 of Jamesons.
Zain
1:00:51
you have a real answer there?
Zain
1:00:54
Okay, Corey, same question for you. What's the strategy for Kenney as he opens? Is it a big commemoration? Is it not? Is it low-key? Is it your analogy of cool guys don't look at explosions? and take victory laps what is it for jason kenney on july 1st when alberta fully reopens in in phase three i
Corey
1:01:11
think if i were him i would welcome people back to the ledge grounds for the canada day pancake breakfast and and be there flipping them and and maybe
Corey
1:01:20
maybe if you don't want to do it in edmonton because god knows edmonton can be kind of tense
Corey
1:01:24
tense territory for the conservatives then do it at mcdougall down in calgary and um yeah
Corey
1:01:30
yeah like you don't need to go over over the top but you can say We do this every year. It's so great to be able to do this again. I'm so happy that we're open again. And it's because of you, Alberta. And, you know, the kind of the wink and the nod is because of me, because nobody else is open right now.
Zain
1:01:48
Carter, last question. An hour or so has passed. Are you still in on Trey Young?
Zain
1:01:55
yeah okay good good answer we're gonna leave it there that's a wrap on episode 934 of the strategist my name is Zaid Velji with me as always Corey Hogan Stephen Carter and we will see you next time this
Zain
1:02:14
is a strategist episode 934 my name is
Corey
1:02:17
is Zaid there's no time we've got to talk talk about israel cory
Zain
1:02:22
cory could you not could you not just this
Zain
1:02:26
this is a strategist
Corey
1:02:27
strategist saying there's no time for that we've got to talk about the reopening of alberta
Zain
1:02:34
is a strategist episode 930 there's
Corey
1:02:36
there's no time we've got to talk about the quebec constitution crisis i
Carter
1:02:43
honestly can't believe he keeps doing this this
Corey
1:02:47
a strategist episode 9
Corey
1:02:49
Zane, there's no time for that. We've got to talk about whatever the fuck you've got planned.
Zain
1:02:55
just want to know what you're going to do with all of these.
Zain
1:02:58
Like, are you going to give them away as, like, NFTs to...
Carter
1:03:02
to... Oh, shit. We've got to do an NFT. Or else are we going to make dozens of dollars.
Corey
1:03:08
Okay, we'll go for real. We'll go for real.
Corey
1:03:11
This is a strategist episode nine. Zane, there's no time for that. We've got to talk about all of the things that have gone on at the G7.
Corey
1:03:18
See how I stopped
Zain
1:03:19
stopped just to give you space?
Zain
1:03:23
you call a pro.
Zain
1:03:24
This is a Strategist episode 934.
Corey
1:03:26
934. Zane, there's no time. We've got to talk about Steven's birthday.
Zain
1:03:32
totally forgot about that
Zain
1:03:36
This is what happens when I watch the clock and don't check my ego.
Zain
1:03:42
You're going to do it anyway, so fuck off.
Corey
1:03:46
Zane, there's no time.
Carter
1:03:47
time. no time we
Corey
1:03:48
we have to talk about the sky palace
Zain
1:03:52
you're just it's good you get this premier subscriber content for folks i'm glad i'm glad you have it available cory it's your fucking ringtone we should sell ringtones by the way you're just gonna sell bumper stickers say zane there's no time all
Carter
1:04:08
all the money's in nfts
Zain
1:04:08
nfts oh man the nft market is crashing like crazy it's it's awesome to watch watch it's just getting
Corey
1:04:15
for us to do our nft yeah
Carter
1:04:17
yeah as soon as it hits the bottom that's when we'll jump in let
Corey
1:04:20
just go or do you want to read no let's do a new one