Transcript
SPEAKER_02
0:02
This is The Strategist, episode 811. My name is Zain Velji. With me, as always, Corey Hogan, Stephen Carter.
Corey
0:12
It's another Sunday. I already had some people texting me saying, where the hell is the podcast? Apparently, unaware that we always release it at the exact same time on Sunday. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02
0:21
Yeah. I mean, consistency is key. That is what we are known for. Yeah. Yeah. That's good. Good. Corey, what's going on in your world? Are we collectively, you and I, going to be responsible for freeing Woj? Is that our responsibility at this point? Oh,
Corey
0:38
we've got to free Woj. This is the big controversy in the NBA right now. A commentator famous for breaking all of the news in the NBA, like one of the most notorious commentators in all of sports. He sent a very terse email to a U.S. senator, which i think just can be summarized two words fuck off that's
SPEAKER_02
0:59
that's pretty much what
SPEAKER_02
1:02
what are you trying to get in there carter what do you know about this what
Carter
1:05
what do i know about this
Carter
1:07
tell you all i know all you need to know and that is that free speech is allowed in the united states until you criticize a republican senator are
SPEAKER_02
1:16
you willing are you were you willing to sign your name to a letter carter
Carter
1:19
carter with that yeah i'm gonna put my name on a letter this is what's wrong with cancel culture right here right
Carter
1:28
it's it's that level of indignation that of course i've
Carter
1:32
i've never been more upset with someone being suspended in my whole life someone
SPEAKER_02
1:35
someone that you did not know cory you know i i'd say that the real test for the soul of america is definitely not biden versus trump it is of course the battle of shemps versus woj uh and
Corey
1:47
and i'm team woj i am team
Corey
1:49
Champs, for obvious reasons.
SPEAKER_02
1:53
The upstart brown guy battling the establishment white dude. Be real. And, of course, if we've lost all our listeners, don't worry. Stephen Carter knows everything about this topic, so he'll explain it to you. Speaking of Stephen Carter, it is that level of indignation and ignorance that was, of course, what attracted the state broadcaster to allow Carter to cheat on us by
SPEAKER_02
2:13
by joining another podcast. i was
Carter
2:15
was once on west of center which makes you and i uh the two of the three people who've been on west of center on this podcast obviously you know
Carter
2:23
know they're picking the the prime the prime opinions not none of this second rate shit from you hogan none
Corey
2:30
none of that no no no i think this is like working your way up to asking the prettiest girl at the school out you
Corey
2:37
start you get your confidence with a guy like zane oh yeah move on to a steven you know they'll they'll talk to themselves in in the mirror for a while, and ultimately the last meal happened. That's
SPEAKER_02
2:47
It's that sense of self that's just so endearing to us and our fans, Corey, about you. Okay, let's move it on to our first segment, Can We Be Friends With Benefits? Alright, guys.
SPEAKER_02
3:00
We discussed... By the way, I have to start on this note. The Toronto Sun stole
SPEAKER_02
3:06
stole my segment title. And
SPEAKER_02
3:07
I don't mean to be petty, but
SPEAKER_02
3:09
but there is only one way that they could have come up with the segment title. or the headline that they had in their newspaper, and that was stealing it from this podcast. So I just want to put them on notice. It's
SPEAKER_02
3:18
It's not a thing we really do because we're very friendly. We're very giving on this podcast. We're not petty. But I'm going to put them on notice and tell them to, as the famous Adrian Wojnowski says, to fuck off. I feel like they
SPEAKER_02
3:32
It's a good callback.
SPEAKER_02
3:34
Yeah, okay, good. Good callback.
SPEAKER_02
3:34
callback. Yeah, there you go. All righty, guys. So last week, Stephen Carter, of course, prognosticated that this story was not that big of a deal. a few more developments have
Carter
3:44
My record for prediction remains exactly the same, exactly the same as it always has. I am amazing at it. So
Carter
3:52
So the fact that over a quarter of a million dollars has now been paid to the Trudeau family, that is new information. That's new information that I did not have when I last made the prediction. Let's
SPEAKER_02
4:04
Let's start with that because there's been several layers of new information, But I don't think none as more relevant as what you just mentioned, Carter, which was over the course of 28 events, Margaret Trudeau got paid a quarter of a million dollars. Justin Trudeau's brother, Alexandre Trudeau, got paid $32,000, so totaling close to $300,000 in speaking fees. With that piece of information layered on top of what we had talked about last week, and if you want the backstory on last week, you can go to last week's episode. But let's start here. Carter, is this now scandal territory with what we've learned this week? Let's start with this first sort of adding to the layer. Well,
Carter
4:41
Well, I think that scandal is an interesting word, but this is absolutely potential conflict of interest territory. This is absolutely, yes, they should go to the ethics commissioner and get a ruling territory. Scandal is not for us to
Carter
4:56
to decide. That is determined by the people and whether or not they choose to give a fuck. At this particular moment, they don't, so it doesn't seem to raise to scandal level. Certainly the political commentators care, the conservatives care. I care. I mean, I'm looking at this and saying this doesn't pass a smell test. It doesn't make sense to me that someone didn't know that this was actually happening. When we made our comment last time, my belief was that Trudeau and his wife for giving their time freely to a charity, and I didn't see it as a conflict.
Carter
5:33
This is bringing new information, and I eagerly await to find out what the ethics commissioner says, because this very well could be now a conflict of interest.
SPEAKER_02
5:43
Corey, where do you classify this with the new information we've learned this week?
Corey
5:47
Yeah, if you don't care about this, you don't actually care about conflict of interest. It's not a potential conflict of interest. With the facts we have at the table, it's a conflict of interest. The Conflict of Interest Act describes it as Because, you know, a benefit, which, by the way, doesn't even need to be pecuniary, as we said, doesn't need to be about money for either yourself, your family, or your friends. And it was arguable whether or not it was a benefit for friends. But when you're talking about family, immediate family being paid hundreds of thousands of dollars by an organization, so, like, the idea that, okay, it's the profit wing of the nonprofit charity, I mean, that's a distinction without a difference at this point. The two are basically joined at the hip.
Corey
6:30
That is a conflict of interest. That is a textbook conflict of interest. And there's just no getting around that. And the liberal whataboutism and the partisans right now going around saying no big, it's driving me mental because it's a big, it's a significant concern that the prime minister would not recuse themselves from a cabinet decision like this. Carter,
SPEAKER_02
6:51
Carter, do you feel like this conflict of interest, especially with Trudeau, do you feel like it would have made a difference had he actually recused himself from the decision? Or do you feel like the damage here is done regardless?
Carter
7:05
No, I think that he could have recused himself from the decision and the decision would have been much cleaner. I mean, they keep trying to drag other people into this problem. I mean, today you've shared with us the Globe and Mail article trying to bring Katie Telford into this and Seamus O'Regan. um you know because they raised four hundred thousand dollars that's not their benefit they're they're connected to the charity that is not a conflict of interest in my mind um bill
Carter
7:31
bill borno the finance minister's daughter volunteered with the organization not a conflict of interest as soon as money changes hands that is a conflict of interest and it's easier to sit out the decision especially when you're prime minister this isn't really your decision to make um yes all decisions are made by the prime minister's office but at the same time the decision can be made and they can stand on the sidelines we've seen this dozens of times where politicians will all but make the decision stand aside for conflict of interest reasons the decision gets made and they're able to say see i stood aside the conflict of interest there isn't one because i took the step to to remove myself from the final decision making process that's what should have been done those Those around the prime minister should have advised him to do that. Don't worry, sir. We got this. You don't need to be in the room. Why would you put yourself in that type of position is
Carter
8:26
the real question here for me, because that's where the judgment failing is. It's not a problem with, well, I didn't like the decision to
Carter
8:34
to give this $900 million to the charity anyways, but this is far bigger than the decision to give away the money.
Corey
8:45
Yeah, well, they would have been on legally more solid ground for sure. It wouldn't be such a slam dunk case of conflict of interest. But there's still the foundational how was this decision made, right? I mean, let's not forget there was still this sole sourcing of this contract. And it's hilarious to me people are talking about Cabinet making this. You know, Cabinet is where things go to get ratified, not decided. The decision was made prior to it getting to Cabinet. There had to be briefs. there had to be a briefing of the prime minister i am sure and uh and everything had to be signed off ahead of time before it even got to that final gate and um and
Corey
9:21
and so yeah like the fact that he decided he needed to be in the room for it is is wild to me i i think that if he was in any way aware of these speaking fees that were coming in for his family and by the way the one for his wife not a big i mean it's twelve hundred dollars it's not nothing i think it's twelve hundred but the The idea is, like, we're talking hundreds of thousands for his mother. Like, that's a totally different game. Like, that's not, I forgot money. That was my income, money,
Corey
9:48
if you're a rich person.
Corey
9:50
And so I don't think we can say that was the only error here. I guess that's the thing I would really emphasize. There was still the fundamental decision to sole source that had to occur by someone somewhere that got ultimately ratified by Cabinet. Carter,
SPEAKER_02
10:04
Carter, I want to go to you in a second, but Corey, back at you for a minute here. You mentioned if he knew that his mother was getting paid this money, is it reasonable for us as citizens to expect? Is it reasonable for Trudeau to know about these things? I want to get to that reasonable question because we're talking about distinctions without difference, something you brought up.
SPEAKER_02
10:27
At this point, it doesn't matter. The coziness relationship is trying to be injected into the narrative with the liberals at large. This concept of whether he was in the room or not, people are putting that as a distinction, you know, without any difference. Should he have known, though? And does that matter?
Corey
10:43
Well, at this point, I'm just grasping for how could anybody think this was okay? And the only thing I can come up with is that he was. But like, it doesn't even make sense. It's like, hey, mom, how have you been? Oh, you've been speaking at we for the last, I don't know, year and a half, pretty consistently. Well, that's, that's pretty tough to suggest that you don't know there's some sort of relationship there, unless you just do not have a relationship with your mother. And I don't know, I just I am at a loss on this one. I have no idea how many fail safes had to fail for them to move forward, knowing now what we know now. Carter, that same basic question,
SPEAKER_02
11:20
should we have expected him to know?
Carter
11:24
Well, I mean, I guess that's your last line of defense now, ignorance. That's, you know, I mean, that could legitimately be the case. I don't think that would be the case. I mean, it's
Carter
11:36
it's not like you put down on the conflict of interest forms, you know, your parents' income. That's not necessarily where it goes. But at the same time, you know, I know when
Carter
11:48
you're in the office, when you're when you're working in politics, you know what's going to get you into trouble and what's not going to get you into trouble. You have to know, because if you don't, then you could be in the wrong room. And all of a sudden you're having a really uncomfortable conversation with the ethics commissioner. This this should have been known. I think I know that the two speakers, you know, so this is represented through a speaker's agency. right so his mother and his brother are both going through the same speaker's agency i would ask the question who represented justin before he became prime minister in terms of a speaker agency i'd be willing to bet it's probably the same speaker agency because he you know he's been a celebrity he's been you know out
Carter
12:31
out there doing things for a long time i'm sure that he had a speaker agency as well um so i think that this is something that would have fallen into the should have known category as opposed to you know even if you don't know it uh mom you know watching other people go through you know uh being tied together with speaker scandals and lots of people have um you
Carter
12:52
you know journalists have been dragged down on this a bunch of times in the last couple of years you'd be saying you know mom who you speaking with just so i know like you you definitely would want to know that uh in order to make sure that you're you're not in trouble this is this is is what bothers me this is just rookie moves uh these these are rookie moves that shouldn't have been made uh in the prime minister's office uh you know cory makes the point you know this isn't the only mistake the only mistake isn't the the
Carter
13:22
the you know the the lack of protect protection yeah i guess sure there is a uh there's a case to be made that the the mistake was the action of giving giving away $900 million. Yeah, that's a mistake. The mistake in my mind is forgetting is not protecting the principal. That's the job of the staff. They have to protect the principal. And they didn't.
SPEAKER_02
13:45
Corey, is it defensible? Like to your point, I know you were you're baffling, perhaps even struggling for words, which has never happened on this podcast before, as to what you think about this. But Carter said, it's the last line of defense ignorance. ignorance is it a line of defense is it a reasonable line of defense right now if you're the liberals sitting there with your strategic hat on you're thinking of all the moves is one of them on the table hey the pm just didn't know is that a reasonable action well
Corey
14:14
depends on how you define reasonable it is reasonable in the sense that as far as your bucket of tactics goes it's it's pretty empty and that's one that's still there um i i don't i don't know that it's incredibly persuasive, right?
Corey
14:28
Because look, the legal consequences of a conflict of interest are the same, whether it's apparent or real. And if you knew that your mother had a relationship with We Charity to the depth that she did, if you knew your brother did, again, like did this not come up over Thanksgiving dinner? We're supposed to believe you're totally unaware of just the the sheer volume of speeches that were being done for money. You have to act in a better fashion than that. And I guess, ultimately, this is part of why I'm at such a loss. I think this is a pretty clear-cut case. This is a real problem. And
Corey
15:05
it was mentioned at the start, I think, either by you or by Carter, that people aren't actually that keyed up about it.
Corey
15:13
maybe it's because they don't want Shira McKay to be prime minister. But ultimately, that tells me this isn't about principles. This is about sports teams. And how disappointing that all of these high-minded individuals out there have decided just to look the other way on this. Because this is a big deal. This is a big deal.
SPEAKER_02
15:32
Carter, let's play some strategy. You're putting on your liberal strategist hat right now. You're at that table with that PMO, the external advisors. You're thinking through options. You can't change the past of what's happened. What tools do you have in front of you and which one are you picking?
Carter
15:50
Well, speed is the tool that I would pick. Right now, no one is particularly fussed. I mean, the media is up in arms. There isn't a leader of the Conservative Party, so
Carter
16:01
so they're not being able to make particular hay. The media seems to think that the way to cover this story is to try and track down everybody that's ever spoken at a WEA event and try and connect them back to Cabinet. That's diffusing the problem. I'm loving that. I'm loving the diffusion. So as many diffused voices as can be – because you can't take us all down. So let's go add in as many voices as possible and then try and get the ethics commissioner to rule before, I don't know, August the 15th. Obviously, this is a very important case, Mr. Ethics Commissioner. We need it by the 15th of August so that we can continue to govern. And then splash it out, do
Carter
16:46
do a couple of mea culpa interviews, you
Carter
16:49
you know, talk about how
Carter
16:51
how it won't happen again and move on like that. That seems to be speed
Carter
16:54
speed seems to be the tactic that I think
Carter
16:57
think is probably the most important.
SPEAKER_02
16:59
Yeah. Compounded with the fact that people are just not caring. And the summer season that we find ourselves in, Corey, same question for you. you. But before you get into your strategy, do you agree with Carter that the expansion of the other liberal characters being added into this narrative is actually making the story diffuse rather than more robust?
Corey
17:16
Yeah, I completely agree. And I think this is one of those things you saw in the United States with Donald Trump as well. When people were talking about his impeachment, when you started throwing absolutely everything at Donald Trump, whether it was a real grievance or a fake grievance, it
Corey
17:29
it became very easy for supporters to point to the they fake grievances and say, see, this is all just a bunch of nonsense. Since when is that a problem? And that's exactly what is happening now by expanding it to involve Telford and O'Regan.
Corey
17:41
It becomes so easy for
Corey
17:44
liberal partisans who are more supportive than thoughtful, I will go back to, because I am kind of pissed about all of this, to say, well, it's ridiculous. Now them supporting a charity is a sign of a conflict of interest. And that's true. Them Them supporting a charity is not a sign of a conflict of interest. And this expansion where it's just anybody who has touched the Kielberger's orbit or Wee's orbit makes them a conflict of interest is dumb and it dilutes the core argument. So, you know, last week, I think I said, you know, if everything's a scandal, nothing's a scandal.
Corey
18:18
That's true in micro as well as macro. If you try to make everything about this issue, the sky is falling, then you've got a real problem there. You've got to keep focused if you're the opposition on things that are, you
Corey
18:29
you know, to the point at hand, the one that is incontrovertible, in my opinion, that is that the prime minister had a pecuniary interest in his family.
Corey
18:38
So if I am taking that kind of pointed
Corey
18:42
pointed spear and trying to avoid getting stabbed with it, if I am the liberals, I am pointing out this broad expansion. I am looking at the flimsiest parts of this case and saying, this is ridiculous. This is dumb. See, in no way, shape, or form is this bad. And I would be trying to make it less about the
Corey
18:59
the prime minister was right and more about my accusers are wrong. And
Corey
19:03
And there is a real opportunity there if people continue to just throw everything out like that. You know, I saw something on Twitter the other day, somebody saying, oh, Canada has the dumbest scandals. Remember when the prime minister bought donuts and how outraged they were about it?
Corey
19:17
Well, I wanted to be like, they're not the same thing. You know, the prime minister buying expensive donuts and the prime minister approving giving tens of millions of dollars to a charity that has an associated organization paying his family. Those are not the same thing. I think we can all tell the difference between those things. But if
Corey
19:37
everything's a scandal, nothing's a scandal. And if you can point to that other outrage, that's what you do if you're the liberals. I
SPEAKER_02
19:43
I want to close on the conservatives and what they should be doing, grant this new information this week. But
SPEAKER_02
19:48
But before I do that, Carter, I want to go to you, because as much as we play political strategy on this show, we also play communication strategy. If you're we right now, you're probably struggling to keep this movement alive, to keep the infrastructure, the operations alive. We recently learned that in advance of getting this grant, which they thought was a sure thing, they had to hire and then lay off something like 450 people. people. Explain to me right now from a calm strategy, high level, what are you trying to do if you're we? If you're advising we right now, they call you up and say, Stephen, we need your help.
SPEAKER_02
20:21
What are some of the basic principles or the first principles you're thinking through right now to perhaps
SPEAKER_02
20:26
perhaps salvage their brand and reputation?
Carter
20:29
The first thing is to duck. There are no stories right now that you can be in that are going to help you. Then I'd be trying to figure out the way out in a timeline. So the first way out is to end the government scandal. That means you don't talk, you don't add to the problems. Then the next thing that has to happen is some sort of exit from
Carter
20:53
the relationship with the Trudeaus. You
Carter
20:56
be seen to be continuing the mistakes that were made that landed you in this place. So that exit should probably take place publicly. It should probably take place after the ethics commissioner has brought in their ruling. And then you have to try and figure out how to resume operations. And I would do it by focusing on the small ball that you're doing. What is the impact that you're having on society? That's your new message. That's all you talk about. You don't talk about your relationships. You don't talk about what the future could look like. You don't talk about vision. You talk about that which you do. Because that which you do has impact and will have value within society. society.
Carter
21:36
That's where you focus.
SPEAKER_02
21:41
Corey, where are you focusing? Same question. You're hired by WE to give them a hand, salvage their reputation. What are you doing right now to try to get them out of the crosshairs?
Corey
21:51
Well, I think that this distraction is something that we have to lay at their feet as well, right? Some of the details that came in, came in in ways that are deeply deeply embarrassing for we, uh, we making the statement, Oh, we didn't pay these people. Uh, then media providing, Hey, here's the receipts. I think that was actually Canada land. That's it. Uh, well, we've got receipts this show you did. And then they replied, Oh yes, we did our bad. So lying to the media, not a great strategy. Um, but this plus a number of other difficulties that we has been dragging along different accusations about how money is spent and all of that. And I'm not saying that any of them are legitimate. I'm just saying at this point, you're dragging a lot along with you i think this does call for kind of a bold reset strategy something where uh principal players in the charity step away and say what's
Corey
22:41
what's most important to us is this work we do and we have become a distraction here and uh it is far too important for us that the good work of we continue and it's it's time for a bit of a shake-up
Corey
22:53
so i think that's got to be the keelburgers involvement further reducing it from i think think it's already been reduced once but um look i mean that's not an easy pill to swallow but this
Corey
23:04
this charity is at some serious reputational damage right now imagine going into a boardroom anywhere in this country and saying hey you
Corey
23:10
you know for our corporate social responsibility this year i think we should cut a 250 000 check for we yeah
Corey
23:16
how's that going how's that conversation going right now you need to write a total reset story um or else you're going to be laying off a lot lot more than 450 people are
SPEAKER_02
23:25
are either of you focusing if you're working for we right now communicating
SPEAKER_02
23:31
are either of you focusing on throwing the trudeau government under the bus putting this squarely in their lane saying that this is their issue not your issue is that a bridge too far i'm
Carter
23:47
a very i wouldn't do it yeah i'm a very aggressive communicator and i still wouldn't touch that um the reality is that you're allied with this government if not in person in certainly in action and i just would would really be hesitant to to take on a government uh that has this kind of power and and especially when it looks like they're going to survive this and they might do better than than you do yeah there's no way there's There's no way to take them down.
SPEAKER_02
24:18
That's a good point. Corey, you wanted to chime in.
Corey
24:20
Yeah, this would be an example of trading friends you have for friends you want. You're still going to be beaten senseless by your critics, and you will have lost the government of Canada, which is quite a powerful ally. That's
SPEAKER_02
24:31
That's a good point. Okay, let's move it on to the Conservatives. The last group of players I wanted to discuss. So they seem to be going down two tracks right now, Carter. The first is calling for an RCMP investigation. litigation. I want to get your reaction to that. And then the second one is our good friend, Pierre Paulier of the Tories, saying that he's going to try to compel Justin Trudeau to testify as a witness at the House of Commons Finance Committee. What do you first, before we get into what they should be doing, let's assess what they are doing. How do you make or how do you rate the current two public comments or actions that they have considered for this controversy? versi well
Carter
25:11
let's start with the worst move first uh pierre poliev is calling
Carter
25:16
calling i'm going to call into my committee and he's going to testify i mean talk about finding a way to not communicate with the the real people i'm sure it did very well on twitter i'm sure that all of his twitter friends um really retweeted the heck out of that thing but that's not any way to gather the public's attention uh and you're not going to get anywhere saying trudeau won't come and testify to my my committee, and he won't. So this is not ever going to happen. I'm flabbergasted
Carter
25:46
flabbergasted with that as a strategy. And then calling in the RCMP, I mean, sure, it seems like a good idea. Look, the RCMP are going to come in and they're going to investigate this. Well, right now, the RCMP are investigating Jason Kenney's leadership campaign and whether or not it did anything That was two and a half years ago.
Carter
26:05
The investigation is not timelined on political communications. Political communications happen in the moment, and RCMP investigations happen in
Carter
26:16
in glacial speed. So I think that both of those tactics are horrific. And I'll now hand it over to my good friend, Corey, who's going to explain to me why they're really good tactics. Mr. Hogan. What do you think, Corey?
Corey
26:34
Well, they're trying to build good theater. The images of RCMP raided an office, we saw that under the Harper government. That was damaging video that
Corey
26:45
that got played over and over again. And
Corey
26:48
And seeing a prime minister grilled by a committee, well, we saw that too in ad scam. And again, it was played over and over again, not always to the effect they wanted, because Chrétien probably gave about as good as he got. But
Corey
27:01
But they do risk making it all look too partisan. So here's the thing. If you believe that
Corey
27:07
that this is truly, truly wrong, what
Corey
27:11
right, truly wrong, then
Corey
27:13
then you don't need to try to stir it up too much further beyond that. You actually almost need to take the opposite. You almost need to step back, you know, have this pallor and be like, my lord, look what has happened here. We just, like, this takes your breath away. way and uh you know the prime minister being grilled by some asshole committee is not going to do that right you you need to make it seem more serious not more partisan and the two sometimes are almost mutually exclusive like you you've got a you've got to find a way to to match the moment you don't need to put kindling on this one right you don't need your supporters cheering yeah good for you go for the jugular you need middle of the road canadians saying this is too far this is is breathtaking. And you take an entirely different approach with that.
SPEAKER_02
27:56
same question to you. You answered your assessment of what they are doing. By the way, before I ask you what they should be doing, does the RCMP wear windbreakers when they storm someone's place of work? I feel like my consumption of US media allows me to think that they should be wearing windbreakers when they storm someone's place of work. Carter, what should the conservatives be doing at this moment in time they
Carter
28:21
also have bad boys bad boys playing on the loudspeakers when they go crushing through too many episodes of cops um no i mean what
Carter
28:29
what the conservatives should be doing is what what cory is suggesting uh which also pains me but if
Carter
28:35
if this is real and i think that it is real then you wait you
Carter
28:38
you wait and you and you allow uh the forces that will ratchet this up on its own to ratchet it up on its own the media will do that the ethics commissioner will do that those you know when the ethics report comes out you want a fully fleshed out strategy that will allow you to reach the right level of outrage without standing atop you
Carter
29:00
you know the hill screaming wolf all the time and this is what they do they
Carter
29:04
they always are always after every political party now every political opposition is screaming wolf at every opportunity and it just dilutes the actual times when you you actually have something that is serious this may be one of those times sit down let the processes unfold and then be ready when it happens cory
SPEAKER_02
29:26
cory last question that i want to ask you guys just a quick one uh this time next week when we're recording our next episode is this story better or worse for the trudeau liberals it
Corey
29:38
might be better if people don't start actually I mean, what else could possibly be added into it at this point that would make it work? He says, no, now it'll probably be something tomorrow.
Carter
29:48
You're taking the Carter line. I like that.
Corey
29:51
Yeah, I mean, I personally, I want an argument that Trudeau did nothing wrong that doesn't rely on entirely ignoring the definition of conflict of interest and doesn't rely on pointing on somebody else doing something worse. You know, this what about ism I was talking about earlier.
Corey
30:05
I haven't seen that yet online. I've seen a lot of deflection. I've seen a lot of dancing.
Corey
30:12
I want to know what the hell happened here. I what I would like as a citizen in the next seven days is to understand how
Corey
30:19
how this could possibly have happened. Because this is this is like I said, pretty breathtaking. take carter better
SPEAKER_02
30:24
better or worse one week from today for trudeau well
Carter
30:27
well i think it is um better if the conservatives keep screaming and i think it is worse if things suddenly go quiet because if things start to go quiet i worry about what's going to come later but
Carter
30:40
but the continued screaming in the media uh choosing to dig around for anybody who's ever spoken in a we event uh and and pull pulled him out that's nothing but good news for for the prime minister um so if if this is still front page news or or in the our daily rags with um headlines that are bringing in all the other people who have ever been involved with we um well you know millions of people have been involved millions of people gone to these events they're big this is a big group big charity so that will dilute and dilution is good so i think overall um it is more likely to feel better next week whether it is better i'm going to reserve judgment cory
Corey
31:21
cory yeah if it turns out to be one part real scandal 11 parts fake scandal the
Corey
31:27
trudeau liberals will skate on this let's
SPEAKER_02
31:29
let's move it on to our next segment our next segment the masked man reaches new lows guys donald trump Trump, he has finally wore a mask in public saying it's no big deal. Whatever. I could wear a mask. I'm probably the best at wearing masks. I wear the greatest masks. He's now been seen in public wearing a mask. But of course, that is one of the most trivial things that's happened in the United States this week. I want to go through a couple of scenarios and situations that we have seen eye popping as they are and talk to you about what Biden should be doing, what Trump should be doing. Just, you know, have a little bit of a powwow on this American potpourri. And let's start with Trump wearing a mask for the first time amidst a second wave in the United States that is unbelievably horrific. I think Florida reaching a new daily high, beating their daily high every single day with, I think, 15,000 or 16,000 in that case range every single day on
SPEAKER_02
32:19
on their case count.
SPEAKER_02
32:21
Guys, if you're Biden right now, you're watching this case count go up. You're watching Trump having no ruddering and inability to handle it. What are you doing if for biden cory i'm going to start with you well
Corey
32:33
at this point i'm just um like
Corey
32:35
like this this is something that is that is probably worth putting politics aside for and saying how in the world do we stop americans from killing each other by going to covet parties by doing things
Corey
32:45
this this is just really big and it's got to be fixed this is bad this is bad you know lots and lots of people are dying and um you know more opportunistically i suppose if you're biden And you're also probably hoping, oh, God, I hope this doesn't get so terrible that the election itself becomes a total clusterfuck, just a total disaster, which seems like it's a real possibility. How in the world are you going to get to the polls if you've never even gotten out of the first wave? People are dying. Hospitals are just full of sick people.
Corey
33:15
So if I'm Biden, I'm doing whatever I can to lean on every Republican I can. And you know what? Talk about last horse crossing
Corey
33:23
crossing the finish line. I'm glad Donald Trump is now wearing a mask. I hope some of his supporters take it more seriously. But I am reaching across and saying, what can we do? What can we do to save Americans' lives? Because this is looking really bad right now. One thing
Carter
33:38
thing that I am really surprised by, because Joe Biden has one of his principal advisors, Ronald Klein, who ran the Ebola crisis response, and maybe the swine flu too, but I know for the Ebola for sure.
Carter
33:54
And he is arguably one of the most informed people about how to get through this type of thing. They've got all kinds of doctors, all kinds of resources that they could access. Why aren't they not setting up a parallel briefing structure? Why aren't we seeing a daily briefing coming out of the Democratic HQ on what's really happening and the steps that can be taken? Now, I know it's going to be perceived as partisan, but
Carter
34:15
but to Corey's point, you've got to start somewhere. We've got to start doing something that shows what we're going to do instead of just shows the talk. Right now, Biden talks. He tells us that he's going to be better. All of his ads tell us that he's going to be a better president. Why wouldn't you start walking the walk? Start showing us how you govern. govern. Start showing us how you would allow the experts to take center stage, but you're going to use your campaign to elevate those experts so that more people hear them. Right now, the people who need to hear this aren't hearing it. Disney World's opening, guys. Disney World is opening. This is not a good time for this to be happening, but no one is standing up and saying, stop. This isn't what we need.
SPEAKER_02
34:58
Coy, I see you reacting to the parallel structure that Carter was mentioning. Go ahead. What do you have to say?
Corey
35:04
it's crazy it's confusing and confusing is dangerous you can't confusing
Carter
35:08
what are we talking you can't have
Corey
35:09
have a shadow government stepping out of the shadows and just saying
Carter
35:12
saying there is no government process focci
Carter
35:14
focci isn't being allowed to to to brief there are no the daily briefings are over no one's standing up and saying this is a real issue all you see is trump every once in a while standing
Carter
35:25
standing up and saying don't wear a mask oh i wore a mask don't wear a mask i wore a mask because i can't because i'm a big man yeah you
Corey
35:37
is this madness i mean you can keep talking if you want but you're just digging your hole deeper biden does not have access to the statistics at a county level that are being funneled through the cdc and all of the different structures of government that are there it is nuts to think that his briefing would actually be in any way better or additive to the process it would it would just politicize what is already a dangerously politicized so you think it'd be performative
SPEAKER_02
36:03
think it'd be just strictly performative well
Corey
36:06
well what in the i mean how in the world would it not be are you really going to say that you are going to know more in this situation you would just be bringing a different flavor of ignorance to the you can stand
Carter
36:16
stand up and say disney world don't open you have 15 000 cases in florida it today 15 000 i don't care where they are disney world don't open and you can use the power of your campaign and the power of your hope your your vice presidential voice and your hopeful presidential voice to save lives isn't that what you just said
Carter
36:39
you're not saving lives
Corey
36:39
lives you you're politicizing the situation worse all of a sudden it becomes like a proud republican moment to go get covid it is
Carter
36:47
is a proud republican moment to go and get covid they
Carter
36:51
doing it right now this
Corey
36:53
this is nuts this is nuts we're actually seeing signs for the first time of depoliticizing this right we're seeing more or more coverage in fox news and the ilk talking about the dangers of of covid 19 we are seeing the president of the united states finally wearing a mask like i said lowest of bars lowest of bars but it's at least a positive step and if all of a sudden joe biden comes out and and starts politicizing it again,
Corey
37:17
A, that will backfire. B, it will lose lives. And C, he can't just do
Carter
37:23
do it. He's not
Corey
37:23
not good enough to do it.
Carter
37:27
Show, don't tell. Show us how you're going to govern. Don't tell us how you're going to govern. This is the opportunity to show there are significant issues. The same thing with Mitt Romney walking in the Black Lives Matter. He showed us what his views were. He didn't tell us what his views were. He showed us. That was impactful. Start showing us, Biden
Carter
37:48
Biden team, start showing us how you would deal with this pandemic because it's still going to be there in November and it's still going to be there in January when you're sworn in.
SPEAKER_02
37:59
Guys, I'm going to move on to our next one. We've got the second issue I want to talk about in Trump's America this week. This one is the Trump administration undercutting Dr. Fauci. So not letting him brief, as Carter had mentioned, going against some of the advice advice and the backroom conversations where he was guiding and advising strategically what the country should be doing. I don't want to start with the party. Corey, I want to start, if you are hired by Dr. Fauci right now to say, hey, listen, this is happening to me. This is happening to my role. This is happening in the midst of a very serious second wave, first and a half wave, however we want to assess it. What are you communicating? How are you advising me to communicate should i just stay low and let the politicians be the politicians or do i need to actually defend my voice because lives are at stake well
Corey
38:49
well lives are at stake and one of the things people need to keep in mind whenever an official gets trotted out and starts talking whether it's somebody in a forest fire whether it's a physician at a time like this that is not their entire job and getting ready for those things is not their entire job and i'm sure fauci has made the calculation in his own head that he is doing more good even
Corey
39:09
even in a muted version being able to run things behind the scenes than having somebody come in totally fresh who is unaware of the situation, having to deal with Trump's craziness for the first time, and trying to figure out where the bathroom is at the same time they're trying to get a vaccine made for the United States. So I can fully appreciate what he's doing. And I think that it's very easy to think that somebody's job is only the part of their job that you can see. But I suspect this is still a relatively small part of his job. Now, public communications, obviously a big part of the the overall consideration of government health apparatus, he's probably nudging it in a hundred different ways. He's probably talking to his counterparts at the state saying, just get out what you can. Just do your thing there. Everybody is trying to make a sandwich out of this shit right now. And if I'm him, I'm probably just picking my moments wherever I can. But I do not think that
Corey
40:02
that America would be well served by him righteously resigning. Let's
Corey
40:05
Let's put it that way. Not
Corey
40:06
Not at this moment,
Corey
40:07
not you're in a pandemic.
SPEAKER_02
40:08
Carter, anything with his words or actions that you would advise him if he brought you on board?
Carter
40:13
Well, I think that Corey's misread the entire situation, as often he does, because
Carter
40:19
because we're being asked to guide
Carter
40:23
guide Dr. Fauci. We're not being asked to fix the public
Carter
40:26
public health crisis, because no one is fixing that. That's not getting fixed. Under the current administration, under Dr. Fauci's leadership, it's getting worse, not better.
Carter
40:35
But Dr. Fauci, what he needs to understand is he's being made the fall guy. The steps are being taken right now. He is going to be the fall guy come November. The
Carter
40:45
The reason that we have this problem is because we listened to this bastard. And you can already see state governors saying, I think it was Texas, that said we're not going to listen to him anymore.
Carter
40:54
We're not going to listen to Dr. Fauci. Everything that he said has led us to this point now.
Carter
41:00
That's been tested. That's where they're going. and if i'm advising dr fauci i'm saying i appreciate what you're trying to do i appreciate that you're trying to solve this but you're being made a scapegoat so we're now going to develop a communication strategy to ensure you're not held to account for this we're
Carter
41:17
we're going to make sure that we are pointing the finger where the finger needs to be pointed and
Carter
41:21
and that means we need you to get the fuck out of there because
Carter
41:23
because we need to tell them everything we need a tell-all book by august everybody needs this will be a serialized version that's going to go in the new york times every friday from now until november we're going to write a chapter we're going to publish it in the new york times and we're going to make sure that everybody understands the timeline of the pandemic from dr fauci's point of view so that this is you are not going to be having the finger pointed at you we're going to make sure that they are all pointing right at that big fat Pat fucks, it's the president of the United States.
Carter
41:57
my cool there at the end.
SPEAKER_02
41:58
Yeah, I mean, Corey, he did say he was an aggressive communicator. Steven did.
SPEAKER_02
42:05
Steven, I have to interject.
Carter
42:05
interject. That seems like a fucking crazy plan.
Carter
42:09
It is crazy. But look what's going to happen. Look what's going to happen to Fauci. Tell me if I'm wrong. They're going to put him... You're
Carter
42:17
possibly not wrong. No, no, it's a good point.
Carter
42:20
Write it down. But Corey loves taking the stuff that I predict that never happens and playing it like a gajillion years later, okay? So mark
Carter
42:30
mark this one down, Hogan boy. Mark this one down and play it for me in November when they've got Fauci masks and they're all burning them in effigy because we're still having all of these COVID cases.
Carter
42:46
Mark my words. This is what they're trying to do. too
SPEAKER_02
42:49
carter's really pitching hard for the business that doesn't exist to work
Carter
42:52
work for anthony i would
Carter
42:54
would get so much money for this client like i would make so much money off of this it'd be so good uh
SPEAKER_02
43:03
don't even know what to say uh moving on from that for a second if you're team biden let's go back to biden again does fauci have coattails are you just in the position of defending him regardless proxy wise or are you perhaps distancing yourself to like this this this attraction to attract yourself and append yourself to the public health officials seems obvious, but I want to hear your take.
Corey
43:25
Yeah, don't go down with that boat. I don't think Carter's wrong. He is going to be made the fall guy by Trump. Give it a month, give it two months. I think Fauci knows that too. I think that he's willing to go down perhaps stoically, perhaps unreasonably, as long as he can continue to make progress towards fighting this thing. and i'll bet you it will be one hell of a book i'm
Corey
43:45
i'm not i i'm not actually totally abhorred by carter's strategy i think that in some ways one of the benefits of it is it it makes it so much less likely that this guy wins re-election and we've seen what a hazard he is we've seen how many people have died because donald trump is president so you know i don't know maybe uh maybe i got a little bit sold by steven's crazy batshit crazy idea there one
Carter
44:10
one every two or three episodes, baby.
SPEAKER_02
44:13
Whenever two or three years, that is indeed the case, Carter. Last one, I'm going to you. Roger Stone has been granted clemency by Trump. How are you reacting if you're the Biden camp? Are you getting loud? Are you letting this one skate through because it's too complicated and it was expected? What are you thinking of doing?
Carter
44:32
I'm jumping all over it. I mean, it's a simple story. A man lies in court to protect the boss. The boss gets him off off afterwards that's the story um no it's not like there's this giant uh contingent of people who liked roger stone um you know people don't like roger stone the media don't like roger stone and this is an easy simple story to to tell tell it tell it frequently um make hay make hay
Carter
45:00
that's all cory same
SPEAKER_02
45:01
same question to you the roger stone the roger stone situation with with trump Trump, what are you doing if you're Team Biden right now?
Corey
45:08
the fact that Trump once again did something like this on a Friday night tells you everything you need to know about how politically popular a move like this is. So, yeah, jump all over it. One of the fascinating consequences
Corey
45:19
consequences of this is it seems to have gotten Mueller back off of the bench, and he's now going to be – well, he's written an op-ed about it, and now he's going to be called to the Senate to discuss all of this. So I
Corey
45:30
I guess we've got more to come. and if i'm the biden campaign i am definitely well look he's
Corey
45:37
he's got to decide what his narrative is he has seemed to have moved past this idea of relitigating impeachment this will drag him back into the impeachment fight so there is actually an argument to be made for letting other people have this fight and not getting distracted by it but um i
Corey
45:52
i mean we'll see i'm definitely staying live to it i'm making sure my calendar my event calendar is not too busy for the next bit my My communication calendar has some holes in it to drop some stuff in that just stabs the president in the heart for his activity here. But you
Corey
46:07
you also don't want to retool your entire campaign and start chasing this as well.
SPEAKER_02
46:11
Okay, let's move it on to our final segment, our over, under, and our lightning round. Guys, are you ready?
SPEAKER_02
46:16
So ready. I'm so excited that this is going to be the week where you answer my questions correctly. First one, Corey, I'm going to go with you. On a scale of 1 to 10, how bad would it be for political communications? 1 to 10 for political communications if TikTok actually is banned from the United States?
Corey
46:34
I don't think it would matter very much. There are things that happen on TikTok that obviously are politics adjacent, K-pop fans going and getting tickets for Donald Trump. But it's not a particularly political medium. And insofar
Corey
46:50
insofar as it has any political cachet, it's usually in the cringiest sense. It's somebody goes on it, like Jagmeet Singh, who then jumps on a bunch of TikTok memes, and then everybody outside of TikTok fawns all over them, like, oh, look at this guy, look how hip he is. But, you know, it's not a deeply political medium. I think politics will survive in its absence. Carter,
SPEAKER_02
47:10
Carter, same question to you. One to ten on TikTok leaving the U.S. and the implications for political communications.
Carter
47:16
I think it would be really irrelevant, actually. I mean, the real political communications, communications to journalists happens on Twitter and political communications to voters happens on Facebook.
Carter
47:25
We haven't seen any real bounce from from
Carter
47:28
from TikTok at all. Sure, they claim to have taken over that wonderful Tulsa event. But there's been a bunch of events since then. You know, he had to Trump had to cancel an event for weather related reasons because, you know, people aren't going. And I think it's bigger than TikTok. So I think that it's irrelevant.
SPEAKER_02
47:53
That's great. Thanks so much to both of you for giving me a score on that. Corey, over under on seven, Bob Ray being announced as our next ambassador to the UN.
Corey
48:04
I give it a silver star. It doesn't necessarily strike me as a bad choice. He's certainly a very smart man, a very capable man. And the thing
Corey
48:14
thing I think that bothers me the most about it is this sense of nepotism
Corey
48:18
nepotism again. His father had the job. He's got the job. Trudeau's got the job his father had. It just strikes me as very un-meritocracist. But he's not a bad choice if you just look at it from a resume point of view. Certainly having the ear of the prime minister is an important thing.
Corey
48:35
I do wonder how this works in timing with our desire to be on the Security Council. You have to imagine that in Justin Trudeau's dream world, because there's no way this came together in like a week, right? We win the Security Council seat. Bob Bray's going back. It's part of a big push to make the UN more relevant. It doesn't hit the same way anymore. more um but having having a prominent canadian and a prominent uh you
Corey
49:03
connection of the prime minister at the un that's
Corey
49:06
that's not bad carter
SPEAKER_02
49:06
carter over on round seven and bob reagan heading to the un i'm
Carter
49:09
i'm still staggered that cory managed to equate nepotism and meritocracy in the same explanation um this is a man who literally has the resume he he is he's he's a good choice he'll do a good work for canada um i would i would say that this is an a plus well
SPEAKER_02
49:28
well thank you so much carter i really appreciate that okay let's go from on a scale of one to ten here in alberta jason kenney in his escalating conversation with doctors if i can even call it a conversation is escalating barbs with doctors is now saying well perhaps we'll just reveal how much some of you make as part of our sunshine list from a pure strategy move cory what are you thinking
Corey
49:51
why not? Everybody is picking the frame that is most advantageous to them. Doctors are, government is. And you see this in all of the facts that are being thrown about. One of the groups will say, hey, look at the increases since 2010. It's been below the average. The other group says, hey, look at the increases since 2000. It's been above the average. and um there's there's just kind of this competing set of of data now when we talk about these salaries immediately everybody is going to say well okay but our cost structures are different there too if i'm the government i'm making sure that the doctors also have the ability to show their cost structure now every doctor has made these calculations already that's what they had to do when they filled out their taxes for
Corey
50:36
their business so if if doctors are concerned about it But if I'm the government, I'm inviting doctors to provide that information as well. And I would make any kind of sunshine or disclosure have the ability to do that and push the onus back to doctors. This is one of those situations where, you know, the government cannot win. But if they've decided to do this, they should try to do it in a way that's least likely to dig them a deep hole. Carter,
SPEAKER_02
51:00
Carter, what do you think on a one to ten with the strategy that Kenny's playing right now or threatening to play? Well,
Carter
51:05
Well, I'm going to use Minister Tyler Shandro and his words from March 24th, 2013, to emphasize what Corey was saying. He's replying to Kiki Planet, one of the great Twitter accounts and people on the Internet.
Carter
51:23
The highest billing, yes. Paying the highest salaries, the highest rent, and the highest amounts for equipment. if doctors aren't employees paid by a salary there's there's but small businesses and they could make more money in other provinces so that's what he's saying there and he's saying it because uh we pay a lot of money to our to our doctors but those doctors have to pay a lot of expenses he said that in 2013 before he was even dreaming about being the health minister now he is the health minister and he's trying to make a totally different argument and
Carter
51:52
and and releasing financing just the gross amount that doctors get paid. Now, I'm no friend of doctors. We got
Carter
52:00
got into a little scrap with the doctors with the Redford government, and they laid down a couple million dollars to try and beat us in a campaign.
Carter
52:09
But in this particular case, you have to tell the full story. Now, the full story is that every time you go to a first minister's meeting, the other first ministers beg you to
Carter
52:19
to stop paying your doctors so much. Because every time we give give a raise to our doctors. The doctors across the country get a raise. And the reason for that is we pay the highest amounts. Now, we also have the highest salaries and the highest expenses. And that's why nurses also get paid the highest amounts. So if you're going to be doing cuts to doctors, you're going to be, you know, like nurses, doctors, all of these people, they get paid more in Alberta because the expenses are more because this is this is the market that we have have uh in the market i don't think we want to undermine it um doctors are significant small businesses within our communities and i don't think we want to undermine it in this particular moment this is the worst time to pick this fight and uh chandro knows it because he wrote it on march 24th 2013.
SPEAKER_02
53:07
cory i want to go back to you sticking with alberta over under on seven marie renault an ndp member here in alberta uh was speaking on bill 30 which was a health care bill, which proposed significant changes to healthcare. She then accused a member of the UCP government for making faces and nonverbal intimidation. Long story short, the acting speaker asked her to apologize. She did not. And then she was booted out. How would you rate her handling of what's happened? And perhaps even just a broader analysis in your mind very quickly as to what you made of the situation?
Corey
53:39
Yeah, under, way under. In a week where the UCP introduced introduced legislation to expand private health care, destroyed the ability of unions to advocate for their members, and basically abolished overtime. Why would you move the focus to this? You took the focus off the big issues, issues in your box, in your frame, health care and jobs on the organized labor front, and you put it on you, Marie Reneau. Representatives who make it about themselves, parties who make it about themselves, instead of the people they represent, have lost lost their way. This was an amateur move by the NDP. They should have known better.
Corey
54:12
And I certainly hope that they drop this next quarter. Same
SPEAKER_02
54:15
Same question over on round seven.
Carter
54:17
Well, let me clean up a little bit for from Corey. This does matter, right? This does matter. Intimidation and bullying in the workplace is a bad thing. But you chose to be an MLA. It's filled with conflict. And now is not the time. There was a time we could have done this a few few weeks ago we could have done this at the height of the black lives matter movement discussions there are other times to do it but not this week this week is about your agenda items and that uh has been completely undermined um we still don't know what the bills are that have been introduced in the legislature because we're talking about this and if you're talking about out the wrong thing on your time then you're really screwing up quite
Corey
55:02
yeah so that kind of behavior matters a great deal non-verbal intimidation matters a great deal trying to trying to make people uncomfortable in the workplace matters a great deal but you were there you're fighting for a cause here and you've got to matter you got to think about what matters the most and uh at this particular moment you have moved focus off of the things that could have have really moved the dial for you and um and yeah this would be fine if it was a different week but the fact that it occurred this week sometimes you've just got and you know what i can already hear the counter arguments like this no that kind of behavior should always be called out
Corey
55:37
well that's communications chaos and i wish we lived in a world where that wasn't the case but it is and you've just got to focus on the thing in front of you at the time i cannot believe i didn't even know it was for bill 30 i knew it was for one of these bills but the fact is everybody is talking about the action and and not what she was actually there to defend and stand up against let's
SPEAKER_02
55:55
let's close it off with a listener question of course you're like what there's listener questions there are corey you've trained me well leave us five stars we'll we'll we'll then ask
SPEAKER_02
56:07
ask a listener question maybe i may dig it up i
SPEAKER_02
56:09
i may i may ask it but this one of course is in two forms uh the first part of the question is for me uh now that zayn is alberta's vice Spiegel's son-in-law what will his coat of arms look like and which member of the 1999 San Antonio Spurs will be featured the answer of Vinnie Del Negro now the question for you guys
SPEAKER_02
56:29
we're seeing endless polls about the American election national statewide presidential approval right track wrong track registered voters etc which indicators are you guys looking at demographically or otherwise and watching the most and this question comes from Beasley 2010 Beasley 2010. Thank you for your question.
SPEAKER_02
56:48
But guys, what demographic features, what psychographic features, what are you guys looking at as the most interesting thing heading into the November election? election
Carter
56:59
well i'll jump in um seniors i'm very interested to see seniors moving away from the republicans the this is uh one of the things that is happening in multiple states um obviously you know we also can't just look at the the national polling numbers uh we learned that lesson the hard way in 2016 um so we're looking at seniors in in the swing states i don't get too fussed with things like, you know, today's headlines are that Texas is now a swing state. I'm not too fussed by that. I'm not seeing the same movement of seniors in Texas yet. But when those seniors are moving
Carter
57:40
bigly, as Trump would say, then something reels afoot. They tend to vote more. So when you're seeing younger age groups coming out massively for Biden, it doesn't matter too much to me. And there's one other thing that I saw on a poll that, you know, former Warren supporters are all voting for Biden. Former Bernie supporters are almost all voting for Biden. That is a very, very marked departure from where we were in 2016. And that will matter as well.
SPEAKER_02
58:11
Corey, same question to you. Demographically, maybe even geographically, what are you looking at?
Corey
58:16
Yeah, I'm not actually spending a lot of time on polls this election. Not yet, at least. least. If polling is accurate, Biden has the election. And so I'm looking for signs that there may be a bit of a polling miss, first and foremost. So part of my big scan is just identifying where narratives are playing in. I go to Fox News every day, I subject myself to that. I go through all of these different channels. And I try to see whether there are dents in the armor for the Republicans. And you're starting to see Republican channels criticize Republicans. Because if there there is a polling miss, I think it's largely because Republicans have decided not to engage in the polling game in many ways. Insofar as I am looking at polls, and this is certainly not something polled with frequency, but it's really on Biden himself and characteristics about Biden. I still worry that he is just, despite having been the vice president for eight years, despite having these decades of tenure, that he's a bit of a blank slate, he's a bit undefined, and that Yet most people have have locked or quote unquote locked place their vote at at least when pollsters call right now based more against Trump than for Biden. And certainly the polls show that that that is a real vulnerability for Biden, because if all of a sudden people start focusing more on Biden and decide, actually, I'm not so wild about this guy. Maybe I'm going to vote for Kanye or something like that.
Corey
59:34
Maybe not Kanye, but you hear what I'm saying. All of a sudden, you could find that that lead could just evaporate overnight. night. So I'm more looking for a polling fail. I'm looking for the risk that Biden could absolutely collapse if the spotlight's on him. That's what I'm spending my time. Beasley
SPEAKER_02
59:49
Beasley 2010. Thank you for sending your questions. Keep sending your questions, San Antonio Spurs related and otherwise. And we'll leave it there. That's a wrap on episode 811 of The Strategist. My name is Zane Velgey. With me as always, Corey Hogan, Stephen Carter, and we'll see you next time.